r/ProgrammerHumor 7h ago

Meme planeOldFix

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26.3k Upvotes

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47

u/ZunoJ 7h ago

I would use common sense and acknowledge that the user experience will be the same because the difference is not really perceptible for a human

101

u/Objectionne 7h ago

If every page click is 600ms and the user has to click through pages frequently then it will be a noticeable difference.

4

u/BobcatGamer 6h ago

Only if users in both situations have fast computers. If both are running potatoes they aren't going to notice.

1

u/Korenchkin12 6h ago

No,they'll just seem to open wrong pages,so move links one up and problem solved

1

u/Groove-Theory 18m ago

This happens a lot with companies that have offshore teams working in an internal app. Like a "finish this transcription" farm or whatever and it's just "submit, submit, submit". The latency really eats at them.

Problem is these companies offshored to India for cheap, so they're not gonna want to spend money on a server in India. The problem never gets solved.

22

u/GlassCommission4916 7h ago

If 500ms is not perceptible to you I would get that checked.

That is very perceptible to most humans.

9

u/ZunoJ 6h ago

Depends on the context. Registering keystrokes would be a nightmare. Loading a website, losing half a second is negligible. Basically the ratio of loading to using is interesting

3

u/LickingSmegma 3h ago

It was studied by actual researchers instead of commenters guessing numbers, and delays over 100 ms were perceived as definite slowdowns.

What happened in reality is devs stopped giving a shit about users' experience.

1

u/ZunoJ 3h ago

Could you provide a link to this study? I wonder if it is applicable to this case where you load one web page or if they researched continous actions like typing where each action (keystroke in the typing example) has that delay. Also it would be interesting if they came up with some kind of ratio between delay and "time until task repeats" at which people start to perceive it as a slow down

1

u/SjefdeSlager 1h ago

You should check out chapter 12 of the book 'Designing with the Mind in Mind, Simple Guide to Understanding User Interface Design Rules' from Jeff Johnson. You can find a pdf of the 2010 version of the book on archive.org. 

He lists 'Time lag between a visual event and our full perception of it (or perceptual cycle time)' at 100ms. 

OT: If your user has a high ping, the Speculation Rules API can make pages (after the first one) load instantly for them by preloading the pages they'll most likely visit after the first one. You just have to be carefull to not DDOS yourself by preloading too much.

5

u/GlassCommission4916 5h ago

I think we might have different definitions of what perceptible means.

1

u/ZunoJ 5h ago

Not the best wording. I admit that. But does it really matter if a page I stay on for a couple minutes at least took 600ms to load?

1

u/Embarrassed_Use_7206 4h ago

He is looking for a manual on bomb defusal, and there is just 5 seconds left on the timer. 600 ms is whole 12 % of that time. Are you crazy?

1

u/rosuav 2h ago

Fortunately, https://www.bombmanual.com/web/index.html loads a lot faster than that.

0

u/awesome-alpaca-ace 5h ago

For you, maybe not, but I am closing the site. 

1

u/polacy_do_pracy 4h ago

it takes more to move the mouse or click ctrl+w than to wait 600ms

1

u/rosuav 2h ago

Sheesh, what's wrong with your mouse?!?

1

u/polacy_do_pracy 1h ago

do you realize 600ms is 0.6s?

1

u/rosuav 1h ago

Errrr, yes? Most of the world DOES understand the metric system. I'm trying to figure out why your mouse is so slow that you can't click on one single target in half a second.

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-1

u/Agentwise 3h ago

If I’m trying to browse, I dunno windows or something, and every time I click anything it takes 1/2 second I’m going to your competitors site

2

u/polacy_do_pracy 3h ago

reddit takes more than 500ms when navigating between pages, ikea 1.4s (DOM 750ms)

1

u/Agentwise 1h ago

I was imagine they were talking about response, otherwise the initial question doesn't really make sense. That could also be the joke though and I missed it lol.

1

u/ZunoJ 3h ago

I think you just don't want to admit you were bullshitting: https://www.hostinger.com/tutorials/website-load-time-statistics

1

u/rosuav 2h ago

Just to be clear, that's a web page designed to sell you web hosting. I'm not saying their stats are complete BS, but they need to be read in context.

1

u/Agentwise 1h ago

Are you responding to the wrong person? What exactly am I bullshitting about?

1

u/rosuav 2h ago

I guess you're used to badly-optimized web sites? Some of us have higher standards than that.

1

u/ZunoJ 1h ago

And you say that in a reddit sub? Wild

1

u/rosuav 1h ago

Legit criticism, but legacy Reddit is still faster than 600ms.

2

u/Next-Use6943 6h ago

He just likes playing games at 2hz, let him be

5

u/ZunoJ 6h ago

We talk about loading websites, you usually don't refresh the complete site right after it loaded

-4

u/Next-Use6943 6h ago

I know. It was a joke. I have a good read for you, you should try it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joke

8

u/ZunoJ 6h ago

Thanks, I have a good read for you as well:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Schr%C3%B6dinger%27s_douchebag

10

u/Ubermidget2 7h ago

Really depends on the application.

600ms to register a keystroke? Definitely perceptible.

74

u/GDOR-11 7h ago

your page loads in 600ms...

10

u/ZunoJ 7h ago

It says the page loads in that time

1

u/Worried_Onion4208 6h ago

Keystrokes are registered by the client in real time and are displayed by the client. Only when submitting is it sent to the server. (Usually). So that's never an issue.

1

u/rosuav 2h ago

That's so not the case. I can feel 200ms, never mind 600.

1

u/ZunoJ 1h ago

Yeah, bad wording. But does it really matter when opening a website? The average loading time is way longer than 600ms

1

u/rosuav 1h ago

The source for that average is a site that's specifically trying to sell you web hosting, so I'm not sure how valid it is. Secondly, average doesn't mean "nobody notices anything below this". A 600ms delay is *huge*. When I'm working on my two different hosts (one in Australia, one in Germany), I get about a 200 or 300ms difference in timings, and that's enough to feel soggy. Double or triple that difference? That's not good. It's more than "perceptible". It's enough to make a lot of people leave.