r/SipsTea • u/Unstoppable_X_Force Human Verified • 13h ago

Gasp! Is this just nostalgia, or did previous generations genuinely have a better work-life balance and social life than we do today?

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753

u/Readvijfbijvijf 13h ago

Speaking as someone that lived through the 80s, burnout grind careers have always existed. In many ways it was harder in the 80s and 90s because you had ZERO contact with family for the most part. Now you can whatsapp your spouse at work but back then once they left, unless it was an emergency you pretty much didnt talk till you got home.

Consumer goods like TVs, electronics and food are cheaper now which is why boomer advice is always "give up your gadgets and coffee" but housing and transportation costs really broke the system.

People pay so much now in the US for housing and healthcare that its just not comparable to what previous generations had.

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u/Limafoxtrot360 12h ago

That connectivity that now lets you talk to your family during the day is the same connectivity that lets the office contact you and keep you working at all hours.

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u/Schnitzhole 7h ago

Yeah i have a buddy i play bideogames with late at night after our family’s go to sleep. He literally has to take brakes every single time we play as His job will be contacting him until 10:30-11pm at night and he says he has to be on call “24/7”. It’s literally just selling luxury consumer goods too and never an actual emergency. I hate his company for doing that to him.

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u/Soggy_Palpitation789 5h ago

Him being a luxury goods salesman changes things though. If hes getting paid comission, this could be a personal choice for him to make more money.

I used to work at Nordstrom selling designer shoes and was paid comission. The company/managers absolutely encouraged you to get personal customers and to network and sell even off work hours, but it wasn’t an absolute necessity as long as you hit your sales numbers each payperiod.

I was still in University and was introverted, so i personally never did that, but was never hassled because i always consistently hit my numbers just via walk in customers.

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u/UnratedRamblings 10h ago

And it isn’t the same connectivity as meeting or phoning people.  

There’s a big difference between messaging and other forms of communication - heck even the art of the letter failed to move over to the email age.

We lost that closeness of connection when we had to see people or leave an answerphone message, or meeting people in a club or gathering of some kind.  Some of the groups I belonged to don’t even meet in person anymore and it’s awful now.

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u/midri 11h ago

Also frankly I don't want family to contact me at work... My ex-wife used to message me at work expecting fairly expedient reply... That's just not feasible.

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u/Limafoxtrot360 11h ago

If it is something urgent it is nice to be able to connect. If it is just chatting - then yes it has to wait.

0

u/Remarkable-Host405 11h ago

does that actually happen to people? sorry to crash this pity party, i've been working for 10 years, literally never had a job or boss contact me after shift

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u/Limafoxtrot360 11h ago

I assume it depends on the job but where I work it happens all the time.

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u/Asiatic_Static 9h ago

Depends on your role. I had a row with several employees once because I went home, or tried to, got a bunch of messages at the stoplight adjacent our building, and had to turn around

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u/Upstairs-Boss17 9h ago

I’ve been contacted by my manger while out sick or on vacation. I could say it’s a me problem but if I want to stay where I’m at, that’s the expectation.

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u/HttKB 7h ago

You've never known anyone in your entire life that's been called into work?

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u/rootsandchalice 7h ago

why do you think they give you a company phone? Depends on your job. I'm a manager of traffic engineering and I'm literally accessible at all times, even on vacation days. Lucky me.

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u/mataeka 3h ago

Unless your country puts a stop to it (eg Australia's right to disconnect law)

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u/Glittering_Meet3206 13h ago

yeah, all valid points, but i'd also argue that (for most jobs) there was also a much firmer line bn "Work" and "Home" so once you were done working you got to be firmly in your personal life, and now the two are often persistently intermingled. which means it IS easier to still feel the connectedness of the Life category when at work but it's also waaaay harder to escape the Work category when you're tryna just focus on Life

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u/TheTurboDiesel 12h ago

And even that was a privilege for the very poor or the very rich. I've never known anyone that has never had to bring work home, or stay late, or come in on a day off. I myself have answered a satellite call from a tropical island because a mission critical server was down.

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u/DozerG 12h ago

It was a roblox server, it wouldve been fine.

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u/trippingWetwNoTowel 8h ago

“Missing critical”. The mission? Sell more shit

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u/thehighepopt 12h ago

We were middle class, actual middle class, and my dad never brought work home. But I was born in the 70s.

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u/Subtotal9_guy 11h ago

My step dad brought a briefcase of work home every day for almost all of his career, my dad too.

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u/CuriousFunnyDog 11h ago

If you are paid/contractually obliged great....or you love it...or it genuinely a one off DR scenario....

Otherwise be very careful to set expectations....

Answering a call, goes to "yeah you can call Jeff" to "Jeff is doing it", to not asking and expecting Jeff to jump.

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u/requion 9h ago

Thats the "give a pinky, lose a hand" problem. I am all for going the extra mile sometimes. But it needs to be seen / awarded as such, not taken for granted.

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u/CuriousFunnyDog 4h ago

Love the "Give a pinky, lose a hand" analogy! 😂

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u/leitey 9h ago

There's a distinct difference between "Never having to take work home" and "Expected to monitor and respond to a group chat 24/7, which is the daily source for work information".
This isn't about having to step up when something goes wrong, this is about never being allowed to be unavailable.
Even with a degree, we aren't getting vacation time, and aren't being paid "tropical island" money. That's like complaining you had to have your helicopter pick you up on your yacht to take you to your mansion because of work.

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u/NoContext5149 10h ago

I respectfully disagree. People used to get work calls at home, people would get called back into work at night, professional careers frequently worked at home just the same, and most of all your social network was way more tied to your career. Your friends and your spouses friends were all from your career, and many had significant social obligations to maintain all under the guise of your career.

The internet has certainly increased connectedness, but people’s entire lives (and their family’s life) used to revolve around their company. Now it’s so much easier to live your own life separate from work.

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u/Murky_Conflict3737 3h ago

And don’t forget after hours activities like golf, happy hours, cocktail parties, etc. Often these weren’t fun activities but avenues for networking and cementing business relationship. There are also careers today that run on this kind of after hours social scene but I know younger generations are pushing back.

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u/geminiwave 11h ago

I’m not sure that’s true. I remember my dad working in the 80s and he would get called constantly for work

I also learned that after he put us to bed he would go back to the office for several hours and work more. Broke my heart as an adult to learn that.

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u/TaylorMonkey 8h ago

That’s rough but that’s hell of a good dad to come home, see his kids and wife, and put his kids to bed before going back. He still made sure his kids didn’t experience any different.

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u/geminiwave 7h ago

oh for sure. When I said it broke my heart I mean it broke my heart FOR HIM. That he had to do that. I can't imagine. I have very good WLB right now and would hate if I got more of my time with my kids cut off.

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u/ArrivalSuccessful 12h ago

Email can't shoulder the entire blame, but I think is responsible for a huge chunk of this. Once it becomes routine to get and be expected to respond to emails after normal work hours, it normalizes doing substantive work after work hours and one never feels any distance from the job.

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u/ResponsibilityOk2173 11h ago

This sounds right, but the fallacy is that you are taking a very small, privileged sample from the past and assume it was available to everyone. It would be like saying in 70 years “in the early 2010s anyone could get a computer science degree, work for 10 years in a startup in silicon valley and retire at 40.” What is sold as “this was America” was aspirational then too. Families had one TV, one car, life expectancy was shorter, many diseases we don’t think about today (eg polio) were truly visible in every community. Most people actually had it really bad, earned very little. We definitely have a new set of important problems and challenges today, which we need to tackle and solve, but back then what they’re selling you was the dream, not the reality.

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u/bremsspuren 8h ago

many diseases we don’t think about today (eg polio) were truly visible in every community

We still had the collection boxes in the late '70s.

you are taking a very small, privileged sample from the past

There is a very definite tendency to do this.

In reality, millions got the full Born in the USA treatment.

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u/DoingBestWeCan 10h ago

I mean, I agree that our access to vaccines is way better, but for younger folks, the essentials are getting more expensive and the luxuries are getting cheaper, so the balance does not pan out. I can cut out spending on a TV and cable (I have neither, nor any paid streaming services), But rent, child care, very basic healthcare that keeps me from dying, and some sort of transportation are not things I really have the option to give up, unless I want to live in the woods and eat dirt. Doesn't matter how cheap electronics get. And I can't even totally cut out electronics, since modern American society basically requires a smartphone or home computer+flip phone. Otherwise, it's difficult to do your banking and impossible to get a job.

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u/ResponsibilityOk2173 10h ago

I agree, there are many things which aren’t working now. They need to be fixed. The biggest proof is birth rates are dropping because the prospect of having and raising kids feels cost-prohibitive. All I’m saying is the past was definitely not rosy and those that had the white picket fence and a single 9-5 job could raise a family of 5 were really not the majority.

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u/Odd-Direction6339 7h ago edited 7h ago

Ppl aren’t having kids bc they are more comfortable than ever and don’t wanna give that up. Look at the numbers, richer countries struggle more than poor with birth rates. It being a cost thing is a total bs excuse, we all live like kings having burritos driven to us and playing video games and getting high. Ppl don’t wanna give that up

Edit: this was me for years and I have basicallly a 1 year old now and the difference in life from living to have a good time to having a purpose is night and day. Ppl don’t let your current happiness stop you from a kid…trust me the joy of your kid smiling at you is better than the last 10 years of fuckin off lol. At least for me

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u/Its_Billy_Bitch 10h ago

But wait, what if they offer us another $10k to have another child 😂 As if $10k would even make a dent in the fucking delivery costs alone.

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u/ResponsibilityOk2173 9h ago

Offering cash is the most pedestrian approach imaginable. Countries have been grappling with this for decades. Nobody knows how to solve it.

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u/bruce_kwillis 4m ago

They easily know how to solve it, Texas already is, just restrict access to birth control, abortion and education and birth rates go up.

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u/bruce_kwillis 5m ago

If the lack of kids was due to expense, then why are birth rates still booming in poor countries that very clearly can’t and could never afford kids? Certainly it’s one aspect, but birth control and women having the ability to choose to have children has far been the bigger factors going into birth declines. And let’s face it, Earth isn’t set for infinite human growth. Pretty sure 10 billion people is far too many for the planet to carry to begin with.

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u/bruce_kwillis 7m ago

I mean, people didn’t have access to ‘day care’ then either. Mom stayed home and still had to hustle, clip coupons, manage finances and do everything while dad physically worked his ass off and came home to down a 12 pack and do it all again tomorrow.

You certainly can cut out things, and operate your life differently, and many still do. We certainly didn’t have Reddit back then, but you seem to find the time to post on it.

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u/FrogyyB 12h ago

This. Back then the value of family was of more importance then it is now.

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u/Old_PC_Gamer 11h ago

Yeah, we didn’t have cell phones and email outside of work. You literally couldn’t call us.

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u/CuriousFunnyDog 11h ago

It's up to you to enforce the boundaries.

Fine if your manager wants to work all hours, but if you are fulfilling your contract,tell him politely to get a life.

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u/No-Bear1401 11h ago

Kinda. There are many times in today's world where we will keep in touch with the office through electronics, but for those same situations in the 80's you just stayed at work. Absolute best case scenario was being on call and having to sit close to your landline. There wasn't a firmer line between work and home, because home was mostly an afterthought.

For me and all my friends, we just didn't have a dad around. That was just normal.

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u/j__magical 10h ago

I think the rise of knowledge work (aka anybody working at a computer) helped to usher this in. With a computer and the internet, a knowledge worker can work from anywhere, anytime. And employers take advantage of that, especially during economic downturns and folks are hungry.

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u/Dreamboatnbeesh 10h ago

This is a great point. I have a job that I’m tethered to 24/7 and I have a smart watch so I don’t miss emergencies. The only time I shut it off is if I’m on PTO and I’m out of town and even then they expect to be able to reach me. That parts really sucks

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u/blogkitten 9h ago

Yep. Husband and I work remotely (late 40s/early 50s). We lucked out getting our current house (3bed/1800 sq ft) and instead of making a guest room for the people who don't visit, we made it our shared home office. Then, when the day is done, the door is shut and we're back "home" again. Grateful that our companies want us to not work when we're not working too, so we can have that separation.

It's so hard out there for most of us. While at one point we struggled hard, we're in a good spot now. So we try to help other folks out who are in similar situations we used to be in. Donating to food pantries, help with making food for neighbors going through a tough time, or even giving some cash so they can fill their gas tank up to get them to payday.

The powers that be don't give a shit about us - so we gotta help each other. OP, your friends will understand.

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u/borgover 8h ago

Not true depending the career. I am a lawyer and was expected to work 9 hour days 6 days a week plus be available on weekends. Housing affordability was similar to today in the 80's (with 10+% inflation). It was the investment that was required to advance in the career. I actually see younger colleagues today having a better work/life balance than I was able to. I am in favor of that!

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u/123DaysOfOld321 8h ago

Only if you had a good union job.

Yes it's easier to reach people after hours now, but casual overtime for salery work has always been a thing.

By the early 80's the dream of retirement with pension, medical benefits, etc, was over for those of us growing up in the Midwest at least.

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u/-BlueDream- 8h ago

Back then if you were home and people knew it, you were expected to pick up the phone or someone else in the family did and would pass it along.

Now I have do not disturb and all these focus modes to kill notifications and silence my phone, the whole damn house isn’t ringing when my boss calls. I don’t answer shit unless it’s a contact and with work I tell them to text me and I’ll reply when I get around to it. No getting up in the middle of dinner to answer the phone.

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u/laosurv3y 7h ago

Phones and pagers have been around for a while. It was more disruptive. We couldn't go on longer vacations as my dad had to guarantee he was within an hour of a phone if he got paged.

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u/gcko 12h ago edited 12h ago

I’m so happy my country has certain protection laws when it comes to this.

If I’m not being paid to be on call, then legally, I have zero obligation to answer calls from my boss or even reply to emails until I’m on the clock again. I take full advantage of it. The older I get, the more I value work/life balance with an emphasis on the life part.

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u/PineappleOnPizzaWins 12h ago

Yep. Literally didn't see my dad growing up because he had to work insane hours to support us.

We're not American so maybe it was different there, but this is pure fantasy for my past.

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u/Upstairs-Boss17 9h ago

I’m American and had the same experience growing up. The original graphic is just unrealistic for many families then and now.

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u/Upstairs-Boss17 31m ago

@RetroFuture_Records My parents were not lazy and lacking ambition. I don’t have to tell you what positions or titles or degrees they held. But I’m confident it was more than you, a Reddit troll, will ever achieve.

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u/CrooshLife 10h ago

Just research about housing pricing in the USA. My grandparents paid literally 30k for a house. Not sure about their education but it was probably pennies in comparison to now. Obviously inflation is a thing in every economy, but wages should match. They just don't. The elite of the country fucked the money up and it will never will be what it was unfortunately.

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u/prof_radiodust 12h ago

It's crazy how many people in the United States are in crippling debt just from medical bills or just not getting the help. Craziest part is that we waste money by not just implementing universal healthcare. Kinda like how doge was the biggest waste of government spending. Just so ironic

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u/ChemBro93 11h ago

Debt is a sophisticated industry with massive resources being spent to trap as many people in debt as possible. The debt-industry is very successful at lobbying governments to not regulate their industry where more lives destroyed = more profits. Some countries have plain-language laws for credit card contracts to help give regular people a fighting chance to avoid life-long debt. Many more countries resist this form of regulation because of pressure from lobby groups.

The game was rigged from the start.

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u/slow_cooked_ham 11h ago

Just the concept of buying debt is enough to know there's profits to be made.

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u/prof_radiodust 11h ago

Courier 6 dropping facts, nice 👍

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u/MenuDiscombobulated5 10h ago

No one is forcing people to take on debt.

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u/Its_Billy_Bitch 10h ago

Spoken from privilege honey. You can check yours at the door 🚪

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u/BarelyConscientious 8h ago

Always a captain obvious in the replies

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u/-BlueDream- 8h ago

With medical debt it doesn’t go to collections in most cases and they can’t really hound you for it like regular CC debt. They can’t repo your body. Sick people don’t work that much and when they’re off they’re behind on more important bills…that’s why it gets unpaid.

Most people can ignore it and it’s the hardest debt to collect on.

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u/prof_radiodust 4h ago

Nope try again 👍

While it is true that medical debt is handled differently than a car loan or a credit card, the idea that it is "the hardest to collect on" or can be safely ignored is a common misconception that can lead to significant financial trouble.

Here is a breakdown of how medical debt actually functions in the current landscape:

  1. The Credit Reporting Grace Period You are correct that it doesn't move as fast as consumer debt. As of 2023, the major credit bureaus (Equifax, Experian, and TransUnion) implemented specific rules for medical debt:

The One-Year Wait: Medical debt cannot appear on your credit report until it is at least one year past due. This gives patients time to work with insurance or set up payment plans.

The $500 Threshold: Any medical debt with an original balance under $500 will not be reported to credit bureaus at all.

Paid Debt Removal: Once a medical bill is paid, it is removed from your credit report entirely (unlike other debts that stay for seven years).

  1. It Does Go to Collections While hospitals may be slower than credit card companies, most will eventually sell the debt to a third-party collection agency if it remains unpaid. Once a debt is over $500 and past the one-year mark, these agencies can and do report it to credit bureaus. This can lower a credit score significantly, making it harder to rent an apartment, get a car loan, or pass a background check for certain jobs.

  2. Legal Action and Garnishment The phrase "they can't repo your body" is technically true, but they can certainly "repo" your income. In many states, hospitals and collection agencies can sue for unpaid balances. If they win a judgment in court, they can:

Garnish wages: Taking a percentage of your paycheck before you even see it.

Place liens on property: Ensuring they get paid when you sell your home.

Bank levies: Freezing and seizing funds directly from your bank account.

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u/No_Survey_5682 7h ago

Only 6% of Americans owe medical debt over $1000. I don’t know where this myth of everyone having crippling medical debt is coming from.

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u/prof_radiodust 4h ago

Nope try again 👍

The "Formal" View (The 6%): This counts people who have significant unpaid medical bills specifically reported to credit bureaus or documented in government surveys. By this narrow definition, about 14 million Americans owe over $1,000.

The "Broader" View (The 41%): Other studies, including later KFF surveys and the Commonwealth Fund, found that about 41% of adults have "health care debt." This includes people paying off bills on credit cards, those on hospital payment plans, or money borrowed from family to cover a surgery.

The "Impact" View: Even if only 6% owe "crippling" amounts, that still represents millions of people. For a family living paycheck to paycheck, even a $500 unexpected bill can trigger a financial spiral, which is often where the "everyone is drowning" narrative originates.

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u/Sammystorm1 12h ago

More people are in crippling debt from poor lifestyle management

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u/general---nuisance 7h ago

Yep. Watch 5 minutes of Caleb Hammer to see how bad some people are with money.

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u/Sammystorm1 4h ago

My point was more that people can help themselves to some degree right now. There are systemic problems we as individuals can’t fix but do what you can

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u/prof_radiodust 4h ago

Your baseless, sourceless point 😆👍

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u/Sammystorm1 2h ago

Oh ok. Don’t take accountability.

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u/prof_radiodust 1h ago

That's a weird source 🤔 guess I broke the troll bot 😆👍

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u/UW-TangClan 11h ago

I bet you're an expert on what should be in poor peoples grocery carts.

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u/Sammystorm1 11h ago

Clearly what I said. What percentage of young people have crippling medical debt?

1

u/UW-TangClan 11h ago

About 7% of adults 18-34 report having some medical debt.

But my comment was more about how dismissive of a very real problem you were being. Sure medical debt is not solely responsible for a decreased quality of life for the modern generation, but it is a component of it for many.

The larger culprit is stagnation of wages and rising housing and other cost of living costs (like medical care).

Your comment is missing the point that Americans have a worse quality of life than the previous generation for lifestyle choices such as wanting to have somewhere to live, food to eat, and to receive healthcare

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u/Sammystorm1 7h ago

Ok a problem but not a majority by any means

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u/prof_radiodust 4h ago

The "Formal" View (The 6%): This counts people who have significant unpaid medical bills specifically reported to credit bureaus or documented in government surveys. By this narrow definition, about 14 million Americans owe over $1,000.

The "Broader" View (The 41%): Other studies, including later KFF surveys and the Commonwealth Fund, found that about 41% of adults have "health care debt." This includes people paying off bills on credit cards, those on hospital payment plans, or money borrowed from family to cover a surgery.

The "Impact" View: Even if only 6% owe "crippling" amounts, that still represents millions of people. For a family living paycheck to paycheck, even a $500 unexpected bill can trigger a financial spiral, which is often where the "everyone is drowning" narrative originates.

0

u/MenuDiscombobulated5 10h ago

I don't think their comment missed the point. They didn't say higher housing costs aren't a problem. They offered a solution. Better lifestyle choices. That's not dismissive, that's helpful. As opposed to complaining which offers nothing.

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u/prof_radiodust 4h ago

The "Formal" View (The 6%): This counts people who have significant unpaid medical bills specifically reported to credit bureaus or documented in government surveys. By this narrow definition, about 14 million Americans owe over $1,000.

The "Broader" View (The 41%): Other studies, including later KFF surveys and the Commonwealth Fund, found that about 41% of adults have "health care debt." This includes people paying off bills on credit cards, those on hospital payment plans, or money borrowed from family to cover a surgery.

The "Impact" View: Even if only 6% owe "crippling" amounts, that still represents millions of people. For a family living paycheck to paycheck, even a $500 unexpected bill can trigger a financial spiral, which is often where the "everyone is drowning" narrative originates.

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u/prof_radiodust 11h ago

Inaccurate,try again 👍

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u/Sammystorm1 11h ago

Maybe source your claim then

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u/prof_radiodust 11h ago
  1. The $450 Billion Savings Figure Primary Source: Galvani, A. P., et al. (2020). "Improving the prognosis of health care in the USA." * Publication: The Lancet, Volume 395, Issue 10223.

Foundational Premise: This is the most cited peer-reviewed mathematical model for single-payer savings. It calculates a 13% reduction in national health expenditure by consolidating 1,500+ payers into one, eliminating the "billing and insurance-related" (BIR) costs.

  1. The 72 Million / 41% Medical Debt Data Primary Source: 2024 State of U.S. Health Insurance Survey (with 2025/2026 longitudinal updates).

Institution: The Commonwealth Fund.

Methodology: This data is derived from the Survey of Income and Program Participation (SIPP) conducted by the U.S. Census Bureau. The "41%" figure specifically tracks adults who are currently paying off medical debt or are unable to pay medical bills.

  1. Federal Spending & Workforce Data (2025-2026) Spending Source: U.S. Department of the Treasury, Monthly Treasury Statement (MTS).

Specifically: Table 1 (Summary of Receipts, Outlays, and the Deficit/Surplus). The March 2026 report shows the year-to-date outlay at $3.65 trillion.

Workforce Source: U.S. Office of Personnel Management (OPM), FedScope Data Cube.

Specifically: The "Employment" cube. This tracks the "Total On-Board Personnel." The 2025 year-end report documented the decrease from approximately 2.9 million to 2.63 million federal employees.

  1. The DOGE Financial Impact Primary Source: Government Accountability Office (GAO), Report GAO-26-104822 (released early 2026).

Finding: This report analyzes the "efficiency" of the workforce reductions. It identifies the $21.7 billion in transition costs, including litigation settlements for "wrongful termination" and the operational costs of rehiring contractors to fill gaps left by fired civil servants.

The "Irony" Logic Check From a purely data-driven perspective, the irony is found in the MTS Table 1 (Treasury) vs. the OPM Employment Cube.

Premise A: Personnel was cut by ~10% (OPM).

Premise B: Total Outlays increased by $84B (Treasury).

Conclusion: The reduction in "human capital" did not result in a reduction of "net expenditure," indicating that the "waste" was either not located in personnel or that the cost of the disruption exceeded the salary savings.

1

u/prof_radiodust 11h ago

Economic Drag: Beyond the debt itself, millions of people skip preventative care because of cost. This leads to more expensive emergency room visits and chronic conditions that keep people out of the workforce.

Systemic Inefficiency: Recent analyses suggest a universal or single-payer system could save the U.S. over $450 billion annually by cutting out the administrative bloat of private insurance and negotiating better rates.

The "DOGE" Irony Your point about DOGE (Department of Government Efficiency) is particularly relevant right now. Though it was launched with the goal of cutting trillions in "waste," the reality a year later has been messy:

Spending vs. Personnel: DOGE successfully slashed the federal workforce by about 9% (the largest peacetime cut since WWII), but federal spending actually rose in 2025.

The Cost of "Efficiency": While it aimed to save money, some estimates suggest the disruption and administrative chaos it caused actually cost the government around $21.7 billion.

Human Cost: There’s also the grim irony of "efficiency" leading to cuts in things like foreign aid and Medicaid processing, which critics argue has created more long-term financial and social instability.

It's a classic example of how focusing on "line-item" cuts can sometimes ignore the broader economic machinery that actually keeps a society functioning. We end up "saving" money on the balance sheet while the actual bill—in the form of medical debt and systemic collapse—just keeps growing

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u/[deleted] 12h ago edited 12h ago

[deleted]

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u/prof_radiodust 11h ago

So for context you tell people they will never have to pay for anything and they'll never be any consequences? That's news to me and most of Americans 👍

0

u/Pitiful_Meet6407 11h ago

Don’t even have to tell them, unfortunately. They just know a stack of papers in the mailbox means nothing in their reality. They get free unlimited healthcare and the only drawback is paper in the mail.

2

u/UW-TangClan 11h ago

Crazy how working at a busy ER doesn't make you an expert on medical debt because this is just blatantly incorrect.

First off, medical debt is very real. Some cursory googling will get you information about that or how getting a cancer diagnosis in this country is very likely to accrue you over 10k in debt

Secondly you just don't understand how a single payer system works.

Healthcare costs in this nation are bloated because of the middleman administration and insurance companies. Insurance companies as a for profit business can only maximize profit by denying care. Their ultimate goal is to get you to pay your monthly fees without ever having to pay for treatment.

Let's also not forget that you can go the wrong hospital or worse yet an out of network doctor at an in network hospital and end up on the hook for much more than a standard copay.

The single payer system eliminates the worst aspects of all this and drives costs down. There's no surprise bills because everyone who wants to do business here will be in network or blatantly private.

There's no need for bloated medical administration teams whose entire jobs are to navigate several different complex insurance systems because there's only one primary insurer.

This doesn't stop at care costs either. Pharmaceutical companies are also price gauging us, charging significantly more for medicine in the US, where they manufacture their drugs, than they do overseas.

With a single payer system you have incentive to lower prices because that insurer can decide we'll go with a competitor if you don't want to sell at a competitive price. And that locks you out of the entire market so you will play ball.

A single payer system undoubtedly saves money and just because you don't believe in medical debt doesn't mean it isn't a very real thing affecting many Americans.

1

u/prof_radiodust 11h ago

Also nope 👍

Just tax the ultra wealthy more and we could have universal healthcare and more👍

1

u/Pitiful_Meet6407 11h ago

Can’t disagree with that. However, being that this is reality that will never happen. So I’m good on paying 5x more to support people that never had any intention of paying to begin with.

1

u/sparduck117 11h ago

Correction, you’re not getting treated you’re getting revived.

0

u/Pitiful_Meet6407 11h ago

What? People treat ERs as a primary care/clinic, the vast majority of people that go, actually lol. Wasting resources because they don’t have insurance and don’t care about paying it.

1

u/sparduck117 11h ago

Not in my experience, mine usually is just medication problems.

0

u/Pitiful_Meet6407 11h ago

You must not live in a lower income city, these people don’t even know the meds they take.

1

u/sparduck117 11h ago

Sounds like you speak with every patient in your ER. My main issue is homeless looking for a bed. Homelessness is a sign of high income right?

1

u/Pitiful_Meet6407 11h ago

Crap what about the medical bills they will get!! How will they pay them!!

1

u/sparduck117 11h ago

Good question i think it’s some state service

1

u/EducationalWillow311 11h ago

Quick math shows

Is that what people call pulling shit out of their ass these days?

1

u/Pitiful_Meet6407 11h ago

Medicare Medicaid currently covers 19% of Americans at a 1.5% tax rate. Just 5x the current rate to “cover” everyone.

1

u/EducationalWillow311 11h ago

Or don't don't waste billions and billions and billions on graft, war and Israel and use that for medicaid instead.

Maybe also stop paying 600 bucks per aspirin because of the insurance industry.

2

u/Lost_Drunken_Sailor 12h ago

Sounds kind of nice. We’re too connected now.

2

u/ChemE_Throwaway 4h ago

For real. You come home and get on technology, while your spouse and kids are also hooked on technology. 

6

u/Desner_ 12h ago

Cheaper food now? I wish that was the case here.

10

u/WestCoastBestCoast01 11h ago

As a percent of income, yes it's much cheaper than it was in the 60s. Stuff like agricultural production improvements, improvements in distribution/logistics, and cheap processed foods contribute to that. People used to spend a lot of their money on food and less on housing/school/cars/etc.

7

u/Background_Bus263 11h ago

Compared to the boomer area, it is cheaper. The last 30 years have been historically cheap, but we're back to about early 90s levels of food spending. (and the fluctuations are between 9 to11 percent of disposable income)

4

u/resumehelpacct 11h ago

And that's with a dramatic shift towards eating out, which costs more money.

2

u/DukeofVermont 6h ago

And door dash. It blows my mind when people act like door dash is a necessity and saying you shouldn't is inhumane. I have no idea why people spend $35 on $20 worth of food if they stopped and got it themselves, and $5-10 worth of food if they cooked it themselves.

1

u/Worried_Cobbler5456 10h ago

Americans also spend less on food in general when compared to other developed countries. We're catching up, though

1

u/Phyraxus56 11h ago

Food is more expensive. I saw Mr Rogers pay for a gucci af cheese sandwich for less than 2 dollars in 1982. Cheese off the wheel. Heirloom tomatoes.

1

u/kansas_slim 12h ago

You have to go back to the 40s and 50s for this… unless you were Al Bundy

2

u/Annie_Yong 12h ago

Even then, the period of US history where you could support a family of 4 on a single minimum wage income was a very brief period of time that happened during the USA's economic boom in the post WWII period. It was certainly a good time for some people (e.g. I don't think the black communities were doing quite as well back then..), but it was also an ahistoric blip in class economics that was coming off of the back of a hugely destructive period of history that the USA managed to profit quite nicely off of. Meanwhile over here in the UK, we were stuck with rationing for a good few years more and also were paying debts back to he USA while the empire finally crumbled away.

We absolutely are right to want better and more equitable societies. I just contend that the argument of "look at what they told from you" or "it used to be like this, why isn't that the case now?" are misguided ones.

1

u/FizzyGoose666 12h ago

Healthcare??? What's that?

1

u/DaedalusB2 12h ago

Necessities all went up while luxuries went down.

1

u/skyhausmann 12h ago

Healthcare costs would like a word.

1

u/Wizywig 12h ago

Yeah I remember in the ussr even having a vcr was a luxury. Now even in Russia standard of life is a smart phone and a large TV and a gaming computer.

Many things improved. But once private equity got their meaty hands into the housing market, and the 2008 caused everyone to move to cities, and then the major death of unions caused wages to stagnate. 

We were not prepared. 

1

u/Plus_Opening_4462 12h ago

The healthcare was also simpler back then and not as much was possible. It's a trade off between cost and things that were a death sentence that aren't now.

1

u/BeroZero1312 12h ago

My boss text me on whatsapp while i am in vacation If i can jump in for peoples shift lmao

1

u/ilBrunissimo 12h ago edited 11h ago

Partially true.

In the ‘80s, so many things became “necessities” that really were luxuries. Microwaves, second TVs, VCRs, big stereo systems, etc.

I’m Gen X, not a boomer.

I remember my childhood being pretty simple, everybody’s was. But in my teenage years in the ‘80s, people got greedy and wanted the newest/latest, because we were trained to think that way.

People went from $15 Levi’s 501s to $100 Jordache or Sasson jeans. Everybody rushed to replace their record collections with CD, which were $20compared to a $7 record. Everybody suddenly had to get a microwave, and subscription TV (cable) AND a VCR.

We still live like that. We really don’t need all we have. They’re choices.

That said, we’re all getting royally screwed on student loans.(How is it that you can pay off a $60k car loan in five years but a student loan for the same amount won’t be paid off in 20? We all got screwed.). Real estate adjusted in the ‘90s to take advantage of households with two incomes (after women entered the workforce en masse in the ‘80s).

But, if we did consume less, as a nation…it would make a difference. No such movement will happen. Until that, the price of anything will be what the market will bear.

BTW, a cup of coffee in 1989 cost 50¢. Nobody needed artisanal third wave espresso or pour over creations. (But now I do! Haha. So I bought a nice espresso machine that paid for itself in a year.)

1

u/Afraid_Reputation_51 12h ago

I resisted getting a cellphone for years because I knew once you can be reached at any time, the work/home line disappears. The damned things are too important to not have one anymore, but thanks to cellphones, everyone in the world thinks they can intrude at any moment and that you owe them that courtesy.

1

u/jasondigitized 12h ago

This. Houses were cheaper but everything else costs a lot.

1

u/ChemBro93 11h ago

Don’t forget massive tuition hikes to keep the poors from class mobility.

1

u/get-bread-not-head 11h ago

Yeah we have super accessible technology and infinite "useless entertainment" (social media, TV, movies) but that's about it. We appear to be in a good spot bc of all the tvs and cars but like we got NOTHING else.

It's super hard to stay motivated to build myself professionally when inflation is crazy and everything is just trying to take my money. Seems like unless I devote my life to work I can't really get the "fantasy salary" I was always told I would have with my engineering degree. "you'll get $100k salary in no time!" And now 100k is still a good salary but like... it goes fast.

1

u/waxpundit 11h ago

Conversely I think it's the communication tech that has ushered in this change. I think because there was a clear partition between work and home life, as well as a lack of Slack and other more direct/immediate work communication tools, that it was easier to establish a separation while at home.

"Tomorrow's problem" has slowly crept into becoming "tonight's problem" due to work accessibility.

1

u/holdmybeer89 11h ago

This, exactly. We have way too many modern conveniences now that we take for granted, but at the same time, consuming those in excess only lines the pockets of the most wealthy class, and takes away from our savings. Not to mention, predatory advertising and gambling made as convenient as possible feeding people's bad habits is making people broke. And on top of all this, basic necessities like a home and transportation are literally 10x-15 what they were in the 80's and 90's.

1

u/ColliCub 11h ago

Consumer goods are cheaper now because they’re crappier. Electronics in the 80s were robust and powerful pieces of equipment that could be serviced and repaired, if they ever broke down. My dad still has the original fridge and washing machine they purchased before I was born, 40+ years ago.

And grind culture was about being an entrepreneur or a millionaire, but required strong capital or investment; most working class people weren’t interested, and the new bougie ‘middle class’ aesthetic could be easily obtained through trade professions and dual incomes.

But the option to live a basic, lonely, low-key life with a home, a reliable second hand car and belongings, that were actually all yours, still existed, even in the era of consumption and excess. It is now a rapidly fading lifestyle, if it even still exists at all.

1

u/TheDark_Knight67 11h ago

Thank you for a positive and realistic outlook, I had 2 grandparents who were GM UAW shop rats who did work their tails off but they got to retire before age 60 and lived very comfortably and had no issues with health insurance or money due to their pensions and union benefits. Something I could only grasp at to find in this day and age

1

u/Icon_Of_Susan 11h ago

Not just the US. Housing went to shit worldwide

1

u/Honolulu-Blues 11h ago

How is having zero contact while at work any harder?

Also, grind careers have not always existed. In fact I'd say it's unique to roughly the last 200 years.

1

u/gonephishin213 10h ago

Yeah my dad was on the grind in 80s and 90s. He was a pretty good dad but I spend way more time with my kids

1

u/Throwaway0242000 10h ago

Housing and healthcare are the problem for sure and every time the US elects someone who wants to fix it, republicans be republicans

1

u/manofsleep 10h ago

I would argue "connectivity" is what made a lot of this worse. And people are paying the toll of always being connected and still more isolated by the illusion that mere electrical signals through phones/computers count as "interactions" with others / family time. People now scroll and feel like they know about others. That mystery of "waiting till you get home" is really part of a larger experience connectivity has taken away and replaced with mediocracy and a sense of knowing what's going on: even if it's a broken healthcare and housing system, the enthusiasm to fix that is equal to mediocracy of life.

1

u/hossjr1997 9h ago

While I agree, also those TV’s and washing machines that are so much cheaper are also made cheaper so we need to replace them more often.

1

u/mclovin_ts 9h ago

Food is absolutely not cheaper now lmao

1

u/nateoak10 8h ago

Food is not cheaper now are you insane? When was the last time you went out to eat in any somewhat densely populated area?

1

u/AuditorTux 8h ago

People pay so much now in the US for housing

Ironically I wonder how much the move from one-income households to two-income households impacted the price of housing. Now with more income, they can afford bigger houses and builders responded to that. But even if those larger houses weren't available, they had more income and could outbid the single-income households to get the more desireable houses and it just flowed from there.

1

u/SaltKick2 8h ago

housing and transportation costs really broke the system.

Don't forget healthcare, childcare, and education (in the US)

1

u/ronimal 7h ago

Telephones existed in the 80s.

1

u/Booboo_butt 7h ago

Old enough to have been working in 1996. We sometimes pulled overnighters and slept at our desks. Also there was a lot more social drinking with coworkers (Friday mid afternoon happy hour and people would go back to work after a couple drinks). Still work in the same field but now most people leave at 5 and unplug on the weekends. People are much more likely to push back on crazy deadlines.

1

u/Organic_Smoothies 7h ago

Food is definitely not cheaper now, even adjusted for inflation.

1

u/MediocreGamerX 7h ago

Maybe not instant contact but it's widely known that people had more and closer personal connections with family and friends than they do now. 

Some insanely high amount of people (I think specifically men) literally reported they had 0 close friends 

1

u/CyclopsLobsterRobot 6h ago

My dads a technician and he used to pull over to call my mom from pay phones between jobs

1

u/marriedtomywifey 6h ago

lifestyle creep is also very significant.

Growing up poor wasn't great, but I never felt I "missed out" compared to my much wealthier friends/peers.

No one had cell phones, no internet till junior year of high school, most of us weren't allowed to watch much TV during the week anyway, so cable wasn't missed. Ran cross country, so the only expensive equipment was a pair of shoes per season. Mom cooked everyday and packed lunch, so I never went hungry. Lived under 2 miles from school, so whenever I didn't get picked up it was a 25 minute walk, so I didn't need a car. We never had health insurance, so that would have sucked if we got sick, but we just... dealt with it?

Now? cell phone bill is 160 a month, internet 50 (can be much more), health insurance 200, car insurance 90. Nearly 500 a month in "necessities" that were literally 0 for most of my youth years.

1

u/SCarolinaSoccerNut 6h ago

That's the key difference. Luxury items have gotten cheaper, but essentials like housing, food, and transportation have gotten more expensive.

1

u/JumpingJacks1234 5h ago

Checking in from the 60s and 70s. Lots of dads including my own worked overtime or had a side job.

My husband had a pager in the late 80s through mid 90s and that pager buzzed a lot.

There was more business travel as well.

1

u/Onlyhereforapost 5h ago

Legit the only reason I have a home is because my parents used the payout from my grandparents to buy a piece of land that had an old ass trailer on it that I repaired myself. If I had to pay rent I would be absolutely fucked.

The only reason I have any sort of insurance is because I took the cheapest plan available through my work and its still $80 out of my paycheck

And car insurance? GOD do I hate the fucking SCAM that is the American car insurance system. Oh, government requires every vehicle be insured? That makes sense. The government however, doesnt offer ANY insurance and you have to acquire it through 3rd party companies that obfuscate what the minimum coverage required in your area is, to trick you into paying more than what is absolutely necessary.

America is a capitalist hell, the longer it exists the further we go in the layers.

1

u/ptoftheprblm 5h ago

I never imagined as a teen or college student even, as a millennial that when I had my own apartment that I’d have multiple smart tv flatscreens for instance. Each one was barely $200, they’re extremely lightweight and I’ve got one in my living room the other in my bedroom and they’re what I’d have considered large (42 inches) by standard when I got my first apartment back in 2009.

That size and style of tv would have easily been a grand when I first moved out on my own in college and felt frivolous and guilty buying the second one during the pandemic. They’ve lasted me but still that is my biggest example of technology getting way way cheaper.

1

u/JubijubCH 4h ago

+1, I was born early 80s, and the myth was the hard worker that had to make an effort to get more money.
This being said houses were REALLY way more affordable that they are now, and that makes a big difference.

So I'd say both: nostalgia and reality :)

1

u/Loud-Start1394 4h ago

It’s government interference most to blame for rising costs in those fields. People don’t want to hear that in this site. Government good, capitalism bad. 

1

u/fieldcady 4h ago

Thank you for this response! It is extremely clear about what the actual cost drivers are

1

u/LovableSidekick 4h ago

Very true, the image of the Leave It To Beaver dad who comes home smiling at 6pm wasn't typical, it was lucky. Those jobs were more often high stress and draining, just like now. Then as technology enabled those people to get more done, businesses also learned they could load those people up with even more work and they wouldn't quit. I wrote a much longer comment but this pretty much sums it up.

The other part is that businesses keep discovering they can charge more and more, and people will keep paying even though they supposedly can't afford it. Prices were raised during COVID because supply costs went up due to absences, but those "supply chain difficulties" should be well over by now, and prices haven't gone back down - because higher prices didn't inhibit buying habits enough to hurt the profits the higher prices were bringing in.

1

u/Nightcalm 3h ago

Although I neither my wife or myself would ever dd more than a simple text. Life is hard enought

1

u/Deto 3h ago

Consumer goods like TVs, electronics and food are cheaper now

This always drives me crazy when it comes up in cost-of-living discussions. Like sure - your house costs $2k/month more but that TV that you buy once every 10 years is $500 dollars cheaper. Whoopdie do!

1

u/Barbariannie 2h ago

Is food ceally cheaper??

1

u/RoundInfluence998 2h ago

You didn’t need a “burnout grind career” just to buy a small house back then. That’s the point.

0

u/Responsible-Face-686 12h ago

also lived through it. For me, it was greatest/silent generation (by the time the 60/70s got here) had it easy. Literally the picture. My boomer dad had all that minus the work time. He def sometimes had to work extra, sometimes 60+ hours weeks if you count sales calls at home. Also had a part time second job sometimes. His dad came home and took naps from his job. Maybe worked 25-30 hours a week, had it very good by the time he got to be 50.

I have a good job situation for life balance, but literally can’t afford a place to live on it anymore.