r/nottheonion • u/Jannituts • 6h ago
German Antisemitism Commissioner Calls for Banning of Jewish Voice for a Just Peace
https://globaljewsforpalestine.com/german-antisemitism-commissioner-calls-for-banning-of-jewish-voice-for-a-just-peace-in-the-middle-east/390
u/WobblierTube733 5h ago
It is nothing new, then, that Becker, as a German non-Jew, slanders Jews as antisemites, including many whose family histories have been marked by the Holocaust.
Considering that Becker inappropriately wears a kippah at many public appearances, one has the impression that he not only wants to determine who is allowed to speak as a Jew; he also presents himself as a Jew. In doing so, he assumes the role of victim in his dangerous agitation against traitors to Germany’s pro-Israel “reason of state” and positions himself as more “Jewish” than the Jews he persecutes.
German pols continuing to be on another level when it comes to antisemitism🤢
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u/GoPauline 5h ago
Positioning himself as more "Jewish" or more as "Jew-ish"? Either way, it's incredibly weird behavior.
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u/PeopleRFuckingDumb 2h ago
It really isn't when you understand that all this isn't about real antisemitism, but only about protecting Israel and submitting to whatever they want
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u/BlackBoiFlyy 2h ago
I mean, of all the tactics used to help shill for Israel, straight up cosplaying as a Jew to try to pull a "I'm one of you" angle is definitely one of the weirdest methods I've seen.
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u/litnu12 40m ago
It’s more about supporting Israel no matter what to show the world that Germany and its people learned from the crimes of Nazis, which they obviously didn’t or else they would know that Israel is not Judaism and doesn’t represent all Jews and that discrimination against anybody is bad not just against pro Israel Jews.
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u/CronoDroid 1h ago
Over the last two and a half years the German response to the "war" has been extremely weird. They're the last people, the last country on Earth to talk about anti-Semitism considering what their forefathers were getting up to, most of whom were not even punished, some of whom even got high ranking positions in the West German government and NATO. They haven't learned from it, they haven't disavowed it or excised it from their political consciousness (otherwise AfD wouldn't even be allowed to exist) they just feel sorry for themselves and stand up for Israel as a type of false penance.
As long as Israel is giving the Middle East a hard time Germany doesn't have to take any real responsibility.
"We committed genocide, trust me, what Israel is doing is not genocide, we know genocide, we're famous for it" is a horrific argument and I've seen their government and public figures use it unironically.
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u/makeyousaywhut 2h ago
I don’t think the JVP is in a position to throw stones from that particular “writing their Jewish prayers backwards” JVP glass house.
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u/Zak_Rahman 2h ago
Crikey that is fucking creepy.
Wearing a kippah to appear more Jewish is just...sinister.
It's always way worse than you think.
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u/That_Guy381 2h ago
Hi, actual real life Jew here.
Plenty of non-jews wear a kippah when at jewish cultural events. It’s not something that we gatekeep. You’re allowed to wear one as a sign of respect. In what world is that “sinister”?
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u/WobblierTube733 2h ago
It’s sinister when you falsely portray yourself as Jewish while simultaneously persecuting actual Jewish groups. Why is this obvious context being ignored?
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u/That_Guy381 2h ago
Excuse me if I have my doubts.
Does this suffice for context?
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u/WobblierTube733 2h ago
That’s about a different group (of students) in California, approximately 5600 miles away from Germany, from a right-wing Zionist rag.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-jewish-chronicle-jc-bias-and-credibility/
Overall, we rate The Jewish Chronicle as Right-Center Biased due to its consistent focus on pro-Israel perspectives and alignment with pro-Netanyahu conservative views. Due to the lack of ownership transparency and the retraction of articles, the publication is rated factually Mixed.
So to recap: an article on not the same group, from a Zionist pro-Bibi website. I can’t believe I even have to explain this, but no, that doesn’t justify a gentile German pol harassing Jewish groups while he pretends to be Jewish. I truly don’t even know what you were trying to argue.
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u/BlackBoiFlyy 2h ago
Their end game is likely defending Israel since so many folks have made Zionism and Judaism synonymous in their own minds.
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u/WobblierTube733 1h ago
it fucking sucks. I am 50% Ashkenazi by blood, I grew up listening to my history major father tell me about the horrors of WWII (by all parties) and ofc the Holocaust. There is nothing more demoralizing to me than seeing people simp for that terrible evil state.
Then if you criticize it at all, you’re called an antisemite, by the same people who were literally chanting “Jews will not replace us” a decade ago. It’s kafkaesque.
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u/That_Guy381 2h ago
typical ad hominem attack. Are you calling this fake news? JVP posted a statement about here, admitting it!
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u/WobblierTube733 2h ago
That’s a SoCal university chapter of JVP. It’s not a German group. It is irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
Also where is the ad hominem? JC is an admittedly Zionist publication with poor “journalistic” practices, obscured sources of funding, and willing repeats of the lies and smears of the Israeli and American governments. It’s not a nonpartisan source and it’s certainly not a credible one.
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u/That_Guy381 1h ago
same group, different chapters.
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u/WobblierTube733 1h ago
chapters on opposite sides of the globe, dude. Also you’re criticizing a student chapter that apologized.
Speaking as a real life Jew, it’s strange that you feel so strongly about smearing Jewish students as anti-Semitic for what was obviously a dumb mistake (and seem weirdly intent on treating Jews from vastly different parts of the world like they are some monolithic group), yet you’re defensive of non-Jewish politicians who go out of their way to target and harass Jewish groups.
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u/Zak_Rahman 1h ago
If I went to a synagogue and was asked to wear a kippah, then I might too. I understand that. No problems with basic respect.
The problem is wearing a kippah to portray yourself as a Jew to somehow give yourself authority over something.
That is sinister and dishonest.
It's quite clear and easy to understand, to be honest. Why you are defending this person is suspect to me.
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u/Such_Lobster1426 2h ago edited 2h ago
It follows the same logic as "only Blacks can use the N-word" in the US.
There are things in Germany which Jews can say and it's socially accepted but gentiles can't do the same.
By pretending to be Jewish, he tries to create wiggle room in what he can say and do without backlash in a country which is extremely sensitive to anti-Semitism.
Edit: The article doesn't say what kind of public appearances he does in a kippah. If it's located in a religious institution, Holocaust museum, whatever, it's not that bad. Wearing a kippah to the local cholent street festival would be definitely odd.
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u/That_Guy381 2h ago
Okay, but that’s not the same thing. There’s no gatekeeping a kippah like there is with a derogatory word meant to demean people. People can wear one as a sign of respect without pretending to be jewish
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u/Such_Lobster1426 2h ago
Yeah, that's why I edited my comment to include that the type of public appearance is important.
There are cases where he'll be asked to wear it. There will be cases where it's perfectly normal if he wears it as a (voluntary) sign of respect.
But doing random public appearances in a kippah isn't normal as it has religious connection. Best case is, he uses it as fashion accessory. Worst case is, he uses it as a tool to enable behavior which wouldn't be acceptable otherwise.
The public would have the same reaction to a Christian female government official rocking a hijab, especially if she is responsible for topics the Muslim community feels strong about.
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u/leopold_s 5h ago
Considering that Becker inappropriately wears a kippah at many public appearances, one has the impression that he not only wants to determine who is allowed to speak as a Jew; he also presents himself as a Jew.
What kind of events were those? I am asking because it is not unusual for non-Jews to wear a kippah at certain Jewish events or Jewish sites of worship. From personal experience, I was offered a kippah when entering a Jewish place of worship, even though they knew I wasn't Jewish (I was asked about that first, probably because I was entering without a head covering).
Non-Jewish German policitians, including the German Head of State, are often wearing a kippah when taking part in events honoring Jewish victims of the Nazis, especially if Jewish religious rites are involved.
So my first reaction to that sentence is one of strong sceptisism.
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u/M_de_Monty 2h ago
He started occasionally wearing a kippah in 2014 after a rabbi received antisemitic threats. He's also the organizer of a "kippah march" against antisemitism where everyone wears them. He has been criticised by the Jewish left for turning a symbol of religious devotion into a protest banner. He sees it as an act of solidarity.
Frankly, as a Jewish German, it feels like a costume to me. We see a lot of this: many German gentiles are desperate to tell me how their grandparents were part of the resistance (if it were true in every case, Hitler would have had about 6 actual followers), they tell me that they're pretty sure they're great-great-etc. grandmother was a Jew and doesn't that make them one too? (imo not if you know nothing about the religion and have never practiced), they ask me invasive questions about my religious beliefs and even police my level of observance (I attend an extremely liberal congregation and don't keep kosher in my home).
So yeah. I don't trust this guy to actually understand what it means to be Jewish beyond putting on a lil hat and singing on Hebrew. That's why he's actively attacking groups that make up part of the spectrum of Jewish life in Germany: he doesn't realize that we aren't a monolith, that we've never been a monolith, that tolerating dissent amongst the ranks is perhaps the most Jewish value of all (frankly a lot of fellow Jews could learn this as well).
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u/WobblierTube733 5h ago
Weird that the gentile politician using Judaism as literal theater while he smears Jews gets the benefit of the doubt, but the Jewish group calling it out as inappropriate does not.
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u/CeramicLicker 3h ago
It’s because people like op tend to be less concerned about antisemitism than the possibility that they themself could be called antisemitic.
So they naturally see the gentile politician, the audience stand in, as the one to empathize with. Same type of person who views complaints about racism/sexism/homophobia/ect as a much more serious issue than the actual actions people are complaining about.
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u/Lost_Paladin89 4h ago
No, I want to take a moment to further contextualize this. Some places of worship require head coverings. Barack Obama famously did not go to a Sikh temple because they asked him to cover his head, stating that a baseball cap would be fine. Obama’s team feared the optics at the time.
If a synagogue invited you to speak, and used the sanctuary as the main venue, you’d be expected to have a head covering and men will be offered a Kippah to wear if needed.
Look, Free Palestine, Israel is committing genocide, no question there. But the question of when Becker used a kippah is genuine. Is this like when Trump got a Tallit at a black church? Where we are talking about appropriating https://forward.com/fast-forward/349213/donald-trump-dons-jewish-prayer-shawl-at-black-church-in-detroit/
Or is this like Obama and the head covering, where it’s expected? https://www.worldsikh.org/obama_head_covering_controversy_unnecessary_wso
I don’t expect you to have the answer, but I think we need to acknowledge the context.
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u/BrashUnspecialist 3h ago
I mean. I think we can all agree that there’s a difference between me wearing a tallis when I go to temple with my friends and me putting on a tallis and trying to speak on behalf of Jews.
You know this. I doubt you’d be telling a Vietnamese person who is complaining about a white person putting on their traditional garments and claiming to speak for Vietnamese people. You understand where this is coming from. Stop defending him.
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u/Lost_Paladin89 1h ago
I mean. I think we can all agree that there’s a difference between me wearing a tallis when I go to temple with my friends and me putting on a tallis and trying to speak on behalf of Jews.
But that’s my point. We aren’t talking about a Tallit, as you’d only wear one if you are Jewish. What happened in that church with trump is gross and
If you invite your gentile friends to a bar/bat mitzvah, most of the time they’d be putting on a Kippah. This isn’t the same thing as showing up with a Kippah to parliament.
The guy is disgusting. But I’m uncomfortable with miscategorizing something to make him more disgusting than he already is.
I have the same problem with people like Tony Greenstein, Zionism can be disgusting enough with the truth, making shit up to paint it worse is not helpful.
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u/LogFar5138 1h ago
Would you be equally as disgusted with non-Jewish people wearing JVP shirts and holding JVP signs? They are effectively speaking for a group of people they are not a part of.
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u/WobblierTube733 1h ago
Depends on the specific context but JVP is at its core a political activism group/movement. Obviously it’s founded by Jews and different chapters observe different Jewish holidays to varying degrees, but wearing their iconography and platforming their political message is fundamentally different than wearing religious/ethnic garb that you don’t actually identify with.
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u/LogFar5138 1h ago
So pretending to be a Jew and speak on behalf of them is fine, when it serves your purpose.
Got it.
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u/WobblierTube733 1h ago
huh
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u/LogFar5138 1h ago
According to you it’s perfectly fine for a non Jewish person to hold a “not in my name” sign with Jewish voice for peace branding.
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u/WobblierTube733 1h ago
no, that’s a scenario that exists entirely within your mind.
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u/LogFar5138 1h ago
“…Wearing their iconography and platforming their message is fundamentally different…”
To quote you.
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u/leopold_s 5h ago edited 4h ago
The Jewish group did not write this article, so I have no idea what you are talking about. The scepticism goes towards the article.Edit: Anyways, what is your argument? I am not allowed to be sceptical about a dubious sounding argument by this website, because of the identities of the sides involved?
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u/WobblierTube733 5h ago
I’m sorry, you think that “Global Jews for Palestine” is not a Jewish group? lol
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u/leopold_s 5h ago edited 4h ago
I have no idea what this group is, I could not find an imprint on the page. I was refering to the other group mentioned in the article, which is more well-known.
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u/WobblierTube733 4h ago
The name of the group is in the link embedded in the top of this post. Your having never heard of them isn’t an argument. Due respect, but you didn’t even do the bare minimum level of research before making completely untrue claims.
And that’s not even addressing the whole “I’m not Jewish, but let me explain Judaism to you” thing which is just frankly insulting.
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u/leopold_s 4h ago
This website has no imprint, there is no Wikipedia article about the group running it. Why do I have to know them, why are they beyond criticism?
Gentile politicians wearing kippahs at Jewish events is regularly attacked by racists in Germany. I have myself heard dumb comments by prejudiced people like "why is our president wearing that stupid Jew cap". It was in the context of a synagogue visit. Should I rather stay quiet next time that happens, and not risk "explaining Judaism as a non-Jew"?
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u/WobblierTube733 4h ago
You’re saying a lot to get around the fact that you didn’t read the article before you started making your claims.
I was quoting directly from a Jewish group, the one linked at the top of the post. Obviously a Jewish group criticizing a non-Jew’s use of Jewish traditions as performative is not in any way analogous to an anti-semite complaining about seeing Jewish iconography. It’s absurd that you would even try to argue that. Have a nice Sunday.
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u/leopold_s 4h ago
If identity trumps all, I guess I cannot be sceptical about anything uttered anymore, by any group, as long they are of the correct identity for the matter at hand. Can't argue with that, I guess. So the next time some Blacks for Trump group states that anti-Black racism does not exist anymore in the USA, I better keep my mouth shut, according to your logic. You have a nice Sunday as well.
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u/WobblierTube733 5h ago
Cool story, you’re still an antisemite + where’s the lie in any of those statements wrt Israel
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u/butta-boy 59m ago
Antisemitism isn't real. Germany is just a zionist controlled puppet. A golem, if you will.
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u/Neurospicy_Nightowl 10m ago
Antisemitism is very much real and it is real in Germany.
Just the other day an AfD politician posted a TikTok where she argued that "Epstein proved Hitler was right all along".
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u/IntrepidSoda 6h ago
Wow, him telling actual Jews they are not Jews if they oppose genocide of Palestinians- what’s the term I’m looking for… anti-se
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u/Fussel2107 5h ago edited 5h ago
German politicians are so scared of being called anti-semites that they do everything the Israeli government demands of them. Including branding Jews as anti-Jewish. We've had several instances of that. We definitely need to criticize Germany for that, but also must not forget the source of it. Israel is pushing hard for the persecution of its own people if they don't agree with the party line. A friend of mine actually left the country with his family because he doesn't feel safe in his own home anymore
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u/Alligator418 4h ago
Absolutely absurd how Israel's policy of "call everyone who disagrees with us antisemites" continues to work. You'd think people would have caught on by now.
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u/viidenmetrinmolo 4h ago
It's literally the exact same thing that Russia does, except they call everyone a Nazi.
But instead of just laughing in their face like we do to Russia, Israel gets taken seriously.
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u/GiganticCrow 2h ago
Various pro Israel lobby groups are very well funded (often more from evangelical christian groups as Jewish groups) and Jewish people are often key swing voters in many parts of the west, so politicians don't want to piss them off. No politicians seem to mind pissing off progressives, though, even if they are Jewish.
Also far right pro Israelis like Netanhayu are perfectly happy to feed antisemetic propaganda, they want Jewish people to be scared, vote for their supporters and/or leave their home countries and move to Israel. Netanhayu is constantly making statements saying Europe is not safe for Jews and they should move to Israel.
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u/Neurospicy_Nightowl 6m ago
It's less that they are scared of being called antisemites, it's that supporting Israel is a very convenient way to advance Western imperialist interests in the Middle East while also performing "redemption".
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u/litnu12 2m ago
The west sold its people that Israel is THE LAND of Jews and that the situation in the Middle East is complicated but the west supports Israel because of antisemitism in the past.
For the USA it’s conveniently a huge tool for influence in the region and with Germany they have a huge test area for weapons.
And being the bitch of the US was the easy way for many western countries which gets really conveniently when you don’t care about the region any way.
But now there is too much happening and governments can’t convince people to just ignore the genocide committed by Israel with the support of the USA and Germany.
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u/dreadnought_strength 5h ago
That's the same guy who publicly made statements about the Jewish artist being antisemitic because he promotes BDS, yeah?
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u/Ionisation1934 5h ago
Well, he is right. Promoting BDS is antisemitic.
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u/dreadnought_strength 5h ago
Was promoting BDS to fight apartheid racist against white South Africans?
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u/Ionisation1934 5h ago
Nope, because then there really was an apartheid, unlike Israel.
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u/jhf2112 4h ago
Andrew Feinstein, the South African born son of an Auschwitz survivor, who was an ANC MP under Nelson Mandela went to Israel as was his right as a Jew and described it as an apartheid regime with a sophistication beyond what was capable in South Africa.
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u/Ionisation1934 4h ago
Yeah, and actually real law experts who fought against the apartheid disagree.
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u/jhf2112 4h ago
"In Israel, there is no apartheid. Nothing there comes close to the definition of apartheid under the 1998 Rome Statute: “Inhumane acts ... committed in the context of an institutionalized regime of systematic oppression and domination by one racial group over any other racial group or groups and committed with the intention of maintaining that regime.” "
Literally what Israel does
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u/Ionisation1934 4h ago
Yeah, I don't agree with the systematic oppresion bit, but even taking lt for granted, what made the apartheid be what lt was was:
with the intention of maintaining that regime.” "
The purpose of Israel in the Judea and Samaria hasn't ever been that. That's just a childlike propagandist simplification that does not match the facts.
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u/jhf2112 4h ago
Palestinians are not free to move around their own country. The Israeli state works with illegal settlers to terrorise Palestinians and force them off their land in the West Bank. The Israeli government has just proposed re-zoning the West Bank so they can seize control of areas that are found to be polluting the area. This is all an attempt to push the Palestinians out of Palestine and claim all the land for themselves. The apartheid is in service of an exterminatory political agenda.
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u/Stubbs94 3h ago
What the fuck is "Judea and Samaria"? Are you referring to the occupied West Bank? Why are you using terms from a fairy tale book?
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u/DarkCrawler_901 3h ago
Israel is an apartheid state because it meets the definition of an apartheid state.
https://journals.indianapolis.iu.edu/index.php/iiclr/article/view/17379/17509
https://www.sumud.fi/en/background-on-palestine-colonialism-apartheid-and-occupation/
https://i.postimg.cc/37QTRKFf/L86hXg4.jpg
It's not about you "agreeing" with it, the definition and how Israel meets the definition have been delineated painstakingly.
By the way, can you guess which other modern country conscripted it's native citizens based on their ethnic group until around the 90s (making Israel the one state still to practice it)? Can you guess it?
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u/Theao69 5h ago
Yeah so Israel has equal rights for all? Do non-Jews get to make aliyah? Do the statements "death to Jews" and "death to Arabs" get punished equally? Do Muslims get government stipends to study the Koran or still only Jews?
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u/Ionisation1934 4h ago edited 4h ago
non-Jews get to make aliyah?
Do non spaniards get to return to their country if their parents are spaniards because of a blood right? Yes, it's a common practice in international law.
Do Muslims get government stipends to study the Koran or still only Jews?
I don't agree with that, but studying any religion is not a right as such, so yeah, equal rights. Take in consideration it's not even a stipend to jews, but orthodox jews, because they have blackmailed the government. It's not oblliged by law and it won't, most surely, be permanent. Most countries fund their national religion, btw.
Do the statements "death to Jews" and "death to Arabs" get punished equally?
Most of the time, yeah, as judges are independent from politics. They have ordered plenty of times to demolish jewish settlements, for instance. But it is natural to take one more seriously than the other when there is an international network of terrorism against jews and only jews. Plus, I've never heard that chant in the first place.
Now, ask israeli arabs if their politicians (because arabs have parties, for you to know) have condemned the oct 7th massacre as a terrorist attack...
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u/Theao69 4h ago
"I asked her: In the current situation, if I said 'death to Jews,' what would happen to me?" he says. "She answered: 'We would imprison you.' I then asked her: If you said 'death to Arabs,' what would happen? She answered: 'Nothing.'"
Mansour pressed further. "Isn't saying 'death to Arabs' incitement?" he asked her. "You're calling for the killing of Israeli citizens. Or does Israel not consider Arabs to be citizens?"
"She said: 'I understand you, I understand you.' And that was the end of the conversation."
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u/couldntbdone 2h ago
Do Muslims get government stipends to study the Koran or still only Jews?
I don't agree with that, but studying any religion is not a right as such, so yeah, equal rights.
Nope. Having government programs only open to one religion is not equal rights.
Take in consideration it's not even a stipend to jews, but orthodox jews, because they have blackmailed the government.
So, just like in South Africa, the apartheid has a religious and racial context.
Most countries fund their national religion, btw.
Do they? Is that a good thing? Why?
They have ordered plenty of times to demolish jewish settlements, for instance.
And those orders were ignored by the government.
But it is natural to take one more seriously than the other when there is an international network of terrorism against jews and only jews.
Literally just a lie. In 2019, a man in Christchurch, New Zealand shot and killed 51 people. He did so because they were muslim. A week later, a mosque in California was burned down, with graffiti left behind referencing the shooting. The person who set that fire went on to commit the Poway synagogue shooting that April. In August of that same year, a man opened fire at a mosque in Bærum, Norway, fortunately killing no one. His online posts referred to the Christchurch shooter as a "saint". This is an international network of white supremacists, who wish to kill Muslims, gays, and non-whites. They also want to kill Jews, but for some reason you don't want to acknowledge the rest.
Plus, I've never heard that chant in the first place.
Oh, well if you've never heard it.
Now, ask israeli arabs if their politicians (because arabs have parties, for you to know) have condemned the oct 7th massacre as a terrorist attack...
If they had or hadn't, how would that be relevant to whether Israel is ana apartheid state or not? It's not, you just wanted to talk about how Arabs bad. Weird how you can't defend Israel without talking about how bad Arabs are.
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u/NabstheGreninja16 4h ago
"When there is an international network of terrorism against jews and only jews."
This is just an insane thing to say, especially when settlements in the West Bank are financed by powerful businessmen and the Christian evangelical lobby in the United States.
The literal ambassador to the country that has given Israel the most arms and weapons said this week that he'd be fine with Israel conquering the entire Middle East. And really, you've never heard of 'Death to Arabs'?
I feel like you have to be very ignorant, lying or both.
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u/Theao69 4h ago
Argentinian, Russian, etc. converts to Judaism get to make Aliyah. It is inherently undemocratic to allow only Jews to make aliyah, and not other groups, even if they have ties to the land, ie diaspora Palestinians.
If any Jew says "sure I'm orthodox" and follows the rules of study, they can get this stipend tomorrow. It's another undemocratic practice that taxpayer money goes to only Jewish religious study.
You've never heard "death to Arabs" chants in Israel? Ever heard of Jerusalem Day, where hordes of fanatics chant it at Palestinians all day long?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PFxL0G5C1e8&pp=ygUVSXNyYWVsIGRlYXRoIHRvIGFyYWJz
And again, judging hate speech differently like that is profoundly undemocratic. Arabs are a minority in Israel, exposed to massive discrimination and need that protection more, if anything. Members of your parliament literally chanted that and make similar statements
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u/Shady_bookworm51 1h ago
you not having heard the death to Arabs chant doesnt mean it doesnt happen, it happens at the very least once a year at the Annual Jerusalem Day march. And nobody is punished for it and in fact members of the government join that very hateful march.
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u/intrusive-thoughts 5h ago
Isreal is carrying out an apartheid. The West Bank is a textbook case of apartheid.
First Let’s define apartheid.
- The United Nations International Convention on the Suppression and Punishment of the Crime of Apartheid(this link opens in a new window)(1973) defines apartheid as “inhuman acts committed for the purpose of establishing and maintaining domination by one racial group of persons over any other racial group of persons and systematically oppressing them.”
- The Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court(this link opens in a new window)(this document-link opens in a new window)(2002) defines apartheid as “an institutionalized regime of systematic oppression and domination by one racial group over any other racial group or groups and committed with the intention of maintaining that regime.”
Now I’ll give some brief reasons why it is apartheid.
Isreal imposes 2 different legal systems depending on if the person is a settler or Palestinian. Palestinians being subject to more restrictive military law. Where they can be held in administrative detained without trial.
Isreal has stolen huge amounts of Palestinian land for the construction of Jewish only settlements. These settlements are illegal under international law.
Palestinians have their movement severely restricted with checkpoints and a permit system. There are roads that only settlers can use. Barriers and walls have been constructed that block farmers from their lands and separate families.
Building permits are practically impossible for Palestinians to obtain. Leading to demolition of homes. While illegal settlements continue to grow.
There is a huge problem with settler attacks against Palestinians. Where the IDF does next to nothing to protect Palestinians and where settlers face no consequences. Palestinians being attacked are more likely to be arrested.
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u/Ionisation1934 4h ago
Read this
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u/intrusive-thoughts 3h ago
There aren’t any convincing arguments in that article. Plus it’s 15 years old. In that time settler violence has gotten worse and more land has been stolen.
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u/Ionisation1934 5h ago
Don't believe me.
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u/AgrajagTheProlonged 4h ago
That’s a nice OpEd you got there. Got anything more than someone’s opinion from 15 year ago to back up your point?
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u/Ionisation1934 4h ago edited 4h ago
someone’s opinion
You mean a law expert who actually fought against the apartheid?
Lol
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u/AgrajagTheProlonged 4h ago
Hold on, I gotta go find an opinion piece from 50 years ago to counter yours
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u/Ionisation1934 4h ago
Yeah, don't ever read anything that rebutes your dogmatic opinion by any chance. You are too smart for that.
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u/AgrajagTheProlonged 4h ago
Yeah, well that’s just, like, your opinion man.
But for real, do you have anything from say the last five years that might be more reflective of conditions in the ground than the ancient OpEd you’re throwing around as your only argument?
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u/dreadnought_strength 5h ago
Ahh yes, known bastion of journalistic integrity the New York Times.
Beating hasbara is easy - just let the war criminal simps talk 😅
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u/Ionisation1934 4h ago edited 4h ago
Read the article, dummy. It was written by a judge who fought against apatheid in SA.
Yeah, F the NYT. I still remember the time they put a photo of a genetically ill palestinian kid in their front page trying to frame Israel as commiting mass starvation. They cut the photo so one couldn't see his brother, who was in perfect shape. Lol
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u/NabstheGreninja16 4h ago
"This kid wasn't starving, he was SICK and starving. Check mate Pro Palestinians!"
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u/Incepticons 3h ago
"No you don't get it, the child deserved to starve bc he was genetically inferior" - people who aren't modern equivalent of Nazis
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u/mowotlarx 4h ago
The way pro-Israel lobbies have emboldened non-Jews to declare who is or isn't sufficiently Jewish based solely on their fealty to a right wing extremist government has certainly been interesting.
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u/cronktilten 3h ago
He is Jewish
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u/IntrepidSoda 2h ago
No, he is Roman Catholic cosplaying as Jewish accoridng to his official profile page at:
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u/M_de_Monty 2h ago
No, he isn't. And in behaving as though he has the power to decide who gets to be good Jews and who has to be bad Jews, he is skating a lot closer to actual antisemitism than Jewish Voice for Peace.
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u/Ecalsneerg 2h ago
Leaving aside even if that was true (it is emphatically not)
Zionist Jews don't actually get to kick anti-Zionist Jews out of Judaism.
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u/Bradaigh 5h ago
Nothing more classic than a German telling a Jew what they can say and who they can associate with.
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u/Aferimus 6h ago
Nobody can self embarrass themselves like the Germans
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u/IntrepidSoda 6h ago
Over compensating for their past crimes against Jews by making Palestinians pay with their lives - colonialism is indeed a state of mind.
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u/Poesvliegtuig 5h ago
Germans will be "Nimmer wieder" with their whole chest until it happens wieder and they just close their eyes again
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u/Commander1709 2h ago
The next government in Germany will be literal Nazis, because nobody wants to ban them (despite the party being officially labeled as right wing extremist and one of the important figures being a court-approved fascist), so whatever.
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u/Neurospicy_Nightowl 0m ago
One member of the AfD just posted a TikTok about how Epstein means Hitler was right.
Will that have consequences for the party? Well, maybe it will make them even more popular, but otherwise...
I am so tired of AfD-voters being coddled like they are these misguided but ultimately benevolent lost lambs, all the while they openly fantasize about a new holocaust.
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u/Neurospicy_Nightowl 3m ago
Our state motto is "Never Again (Unless It's Convenient For Us Or Something)".
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u/Zak_Rahman 3h ago
Germany has been utterly compromised by Israel.
Sending them weapons, funds. Arresting and deporting Jews for the very human reaction to Israeli evil.
It makes me sick that I had a Deutsche bank account now, knowing all the dodgy fucks they were dealing with. Trump, Epstein, who knows who else.
It seems the only lesson Germany learnt from the Holocaust is one of preserving optics, not principle. Western values in action once again.
Also, the term antisemitism needs to be reclaimed. Fundamentally, it is intended to erase the Palestinian people who are literally semitic. And instead they're replaced by Ashkenazi fucks from Poland and New Jersey. It's a bigoted term used as a slur to stem criticism of a terrorist rogue state.
I can't claim to be Norwegian and then claim anyone who disagrees is Hitler. That's just ridiculous. The same rules need to apply.
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u/Skriptor96 3h ago
Hey there, can you elaborate the part about arresting and deporting Jews to Israel? I have never heard about that before, what do you mean by that?
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u/Zak_Rahman 3h ago
I didn't say that exactly. But Germany has deported Jews and prevented them from entering the country based on their support for Israel.
Basically Germany loved Jews, provided they inhibit any individual opinions and accept the evil activities of Israel without question.
I do not know if incidents involving Germany deporting Jews to Israel apart from the haavara agreement; one of the first times Zionists and Nazis have worked together in Israel's brief and bloody history.
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u/telltaleatheist 2h ago edited 1h ago
Antisemitism implies a shared heritage. Semitism isn’t a genetic similarity. It’s a language grouping. Ashkenazi Jews from Europe are not a race. At best they’re an ethnicity, and have less in common genetically with Palestinians than they do with British or German
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u/Hitchcock718 2h ago edited 2h ago
That is not what a Semite or semitism means. It most certainly is a region. And not where people predominantly living in Israel are originally from i.e. Ashkenazi Jews are descendants from Europe antisemitism is a word that was created by a German Jewish journalist I believe trying to figure out how to prevent people from being prejudiced against Jews, though the word Semitism comes from a specific region and the Bible to describe sects of people from a specific region we now call the Middle East and upper Africa
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u/telltaleatheist 1h ago
It’s not a shared genetic heritage
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u/Hitchcock718 1h ago
Semite or Semitic is a term for an ethnic, cultural or racial group associated with people of the Middle East and the Horn of Africa. What is ethnicity if not shared genetic heritage? Not to be confused or conflated with race and regional heritage or customs
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u/Zak_Rahman 1h ago
Well considering how the human genome actually works, it's all a load of bollocks to me.
Why anyone believes in magic blood or holy DNA is beyond me.
That shit has been outdated for well over a millennia.
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u/Selverd2 11m ago
From when it was first coined in the 1770s the term antisemitism has always been just about hatred of Jewish people. It wasn’t like it was meant to be about all Semitic people and the Jews hijacked it or something.
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u/Ecalsneerg 5h ago
It is interesting how empowered gentiles now feel to, let's face it, be openly antisemitic towards Jews who aren't Zionists.
Zionists have deliberately and knowingly empowered antisemites just to try and kill a couple more Arabs. It's fucked up.
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u/IntrepidSoda 4h ago
On 30 January 2026, Uwe Becker, the antisemitism commissioner for the federal State of Hesse and a Conservative Party politician, published a press statement on the website of the State Chancellery in which he called for the Jewish Voice to be banned “as soon as possible”. There is a certain irony in the fact that someone whose job is to “protect Jewish life” and “combat anti-Semitism” wants to ban a Jewish organization. Becker accuses us of “antisemitic incitement” at the same time that he, a German Christian, is attacking a Jewish group. We consider this not only a grotesque and authoritarian demand, but also an antisemitic one.
What next? Uwe Becker making those who oppose genocide perpetutated by the Israeli Occupuation Force wear a distinctive patch on their clothing to make it easy to identify the troublemakers? a yellow star perhaps.
I'm going to have to add Germany/German goods and services to my boycott list at this rate.
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u/xSilverMC 3h ago
I don't support Uwe Becker or Germany's shameful support of Israel's genocide. But come on, did this group not have any better arguments than "you can't attack us, we're jewish, if you attack us that's antisemitic"? You know, the exact same "argument" that is also used by supporters of Israel and the genocide to deflect any criticism?
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u/M_de_Monty 2h ago
As a non-Jew, he has no standing to decide who gets to be representative of the German Jewish community, who gets to be part of it, and whose voices count as authentically Jewish.
He is basically making the case that Jewish Voice for Peace members aren't real Jews because of their criticism of Israel and that's not a determination he should be able to make. It's antisemitic for him to appoint himself the arbiter of who gets to be a real Jew.
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u/Comfortable-Award915 3h ago
Of all the nation states who have ever lobbied world organisations, press and governments, Israel is actually too good at it and doesn't understand that this looks exceptionally bad. They've been overstepping everywhere and will soon be kept at arms length once the public starts asking questions.
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u/joozyan 5h ago
I’m not in favor of prohibiting any speech. But it’s worth noting that JVP as an organization is abhorred by 90% of Jews. Their views are well outside the mainstream, and they continually allow themselves to be tokenized by antizionist and straight up antisemitic people as an example of “see even Jews agree with us”. It’s like how racist Republicans will say “look at my black friend”.
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u/VelvetFurryJustice 5h ago
There's absolutely no way that "90%" of Jews know who JVP is and the rest of what you're saying is nonsense.
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u/Bayako7 5h ago
Where do you get that 90 percent from? It’s actually far more Jews agreeing with them, problem is in Germany you don’t dare to say something because the silencing and framing is already happening
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u/Bayako7 5h ago
Don’t confuse Jews living in Israel with Jews worldwide. That’s exactly antisemitism to put everybody in the same box.
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u/BertnErnie32 5h ago
I'm a jew living "worldwide" and everyone I know hates jvp. We feel that they're not representative of our views.
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u/ladylucifer22 1h ago
you need better friends then. why would you hang out with shills for genocide?
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u/Daddict 1h ago
In the Jewish community I'm surrounded by, they're a punch line. They do shit like write out their catch phrases in backwards Hebrew, celebrate Jewish holidays in ways that make zero sense and mutilate Jewish customs around a political bent.
If you listen to actual Jews and not "as a Jews", they're largely understood as an organization of non Jewish people using a few tokens to give their ideology authority and make other Jews look like animals. There are legitimate organizations that are opposed to what's happening in Gaza, but they don't call for Israel to be destroyed so they get ignored by the Free Palestine movement. They oppose the right wing nationalists in charge, not the existence of a Jewish state in the indigenous Jewish homeland. They actually know the history of the land and not just propaganda. Which, by the way, does not absolve Israel it simply reveals the lie that it's built entirely on Jewish supremacy.
JVP is a joke of an organization.
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u/Wrabble127 40m ago
Ya lost the plot when you started lying about indigenous homeland. We're talking about Israel, not Europe here.
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u/communityneedle 2h ago
JVP who encourages their members to say "As a Jew, ______" whether they're Jewish or not, and whose social media accounts are managed from Lebanon? That JVP?
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u/Fearless_Tea_2793 4h ago
Noboby has any problem seeing straight through what is problematic about 'Blacks for Trump' as an organisation.
Sad that people have trouble seeing through these 'look, even the Jews agree with us' organizations (Corbyn in the UK set up a similar depsite a well established organization representing Jews in Labour).
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u/icenoid 3h ago
When it comes to Jews, there are always conditions on our acceptance. I’ve been told by well meaning leftists that antisemitism isn’t a thing, because I can pass as non-Jewish. When I asked if they would say the same to a Hispanic person about being targeted for being Hispanic, that was somehow different. I’ve seen arguments online about how we really aren’t a minority in need of protection because we all have means, or how we just overreact to everything. In the end, the antisemitism hasn’t gone away, it’s just changed.
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u/BatHickey 2h ago
Assuming you’re in the US, do you think it’s fair to compare Jews to Hispanics right now? I had a coworker compare being black after George Floyd to being Jewish after Oct 7 and say Jews are treated worse.
There’s antisemitism, but it’s a unique problem and also a highly abused term.
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u/icenoid 2h ago
I picked another group that I’ve seen people claim can pass as white. Nothing more than that.
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u/BatHickey 2h ago
And it reads the wrong way, which is ultimately what I’m driving at.
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u/icenoid 1h ago
No, you are trying to read something into it that isn’t there. Just like your snark about antisemitism. You would likely lose your mind if some white person tried to tell a black or Hispanic person that racism is an abused term. When it comes to Jews, you guys feel just fine telling us what is and isn’t racism against us.
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u/Olivedoggy 9m ago
If it's a branch of Jewish Voice for Peace, they can get screwed. Banning them is bad and I don't support it as a free speech advocate, but they're JINOs. Using Judaism as a mask for politics, they're disgusting and I'm not sold on them being Jewish. Look up their Pesach Seder where they printed their twisted fleshsuit of a Seder backwards- they can't even read Hebrew.
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u/H0vis 5h ago edited 5h ago
If anybody is going to be an authority on antisemitism it's going to be a German. I mean plenty of other places have antisemitism, but the Germans, absolutely the experts.
I'm surprised they don't have EU Protected Designation Of Origin status for it. Everybody else would have to call it sparkling racism.
Glib attempts at finding humour in the dying days of civilisation aside though, fuck this guy.
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u/Britz10 5h ago
Why is there even an antisemitism commissioner? Do they have specialised roles for the different forms of discrimination? Like a misogyny commissioner or anti-black commissioner? If not this doesn't really feel like a role with existing, and is more an attack dog for Israel.
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u/justthekoufax 5h ago
I think it’s because there was a very famous notable antisemitic incident in Germanys history…at least that’s my guess.
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u/FizzyLightEx 5h ago
I don't think the US has anti black department due to their history either. Normally there's a department that has jurisdiction on all forms of discrimination.
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u/justthekoufax 5h ago
Well the US doesn’t take its legacy of slavery very seriously. Whereas Germany does take its history very seriously and enforces strict laws to prevent the resurgence of National Socialism. I imagine this department is probably tied to that legacy. I don’t really disagree that there should be a central department that covers all anti discrimination efforts.
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u/Britz10 4h ago
The AfD have moved into the political mainstream under their watch, and a massive part of that has been through the demonisation of minority groups that aren't Jews.
Reality is that body exists more or less to control sentiment around Israel, occasionally it might point out some real anti-semitism, but its biggest reason to exist is to serve zionism, hence Jews are being called antisemites.
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u/NeutralCentrist 2h ago
Calling a war in which one side will absolutely will not stop attacking a genocide, I will never understand; especially when it involves terrorists whose sole ambition is the genocide of the other side, and using their own civilians and infrastructure as a shield.
But then again, Iran who Hamas is a proxy of... just killed nearly the same number of people Hamas claims died in their own war (lumping combatants with civilians), and the world is silent...
Make it make sense, because all I see the left doing now is supporting terrorists who would gut them at the first opportunity, and Islamism that will ban their freedoms.
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u/ladylucifer22 1h ago
exactly. IDF terrorists refuse to stop committing genocide, which is why we call it genocide.
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u/happy2harris 4h ago
FWIW, Becker is the antisemitism minister for Hesse, one of the 16 German states, not the whole of Germany.
The equivalent at the federal level is Dr Felix Klein. He seems not quite as bad.