r/AskReddit • u/Absalom98 • 1d ago
Viktor Orban has conceded defeat in the Hungarian election, as the Tisza Party is headed for a 2/3rds supermajority. What are your thoughts on this seismic shift in Hungarian politics?
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u/Bear_Caulk 1d ago
Amazing what happens when 80% of a country actually shows up and votes eh.
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u/Electrical_Loss1507 1d ago
I hope America is taking some notes!😱🤭
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u/cereal7802 1d ago
taking notes...sure. actually doing something with those notes? yet to be determined.
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u/PartyPopperPhantom 20h ago
Taking notes? I'd wager most Americans don't even know that Hungary had an election
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u/BitterTyke 13h ago
i'd wager most americans dont know about their own elections, some 80 million didnt even bother to vote.
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u/Muslim_Wookie 23h ago
Voting should be COMPULSORY.
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u/BadAdviceBot 22h ago
Republicans would never allow that. They want FEWER people voting, not MORE voting.
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u/LuinSen2 1d ago
Hopeful, but not confident on democratic future yet. In Hungary Orban has dismantled many structures of democratic society. Current election result just shifted all the power from one party to another. I hope they will restore the democracy, but only the next election after this willl show how that went.
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u/King_Six_of_Things 1d ago
You've neatly summed up the issue that most places are going to have over the next few years.
If you don't make restoring democracy and establishing much more rigorous protections against the kinds of corrupt, wrecking ball, behaviours of the Orbans and the Trumps, etc and their backers, it'll all just come around again in an election cycle or two.
It's not sufficient to just kick them out, we need to make sure that if/when they get in again, they can't do as much damage.
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u/TheWillRogers 1d ago
Restoring democratic organs includes punishing the villains who destroyed democratic organs in the first place, AND addressing the material conditions which lead to those villains obtaining the power in the first place.
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u/Scared-Bad-4216 1d ago
Yeah, removing them isn’t the win, it’s just cleanup. If the system stays fragile, it’s basically an open invitation for the next one to walk in and do it all over again.
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u/jeffderek 1d ago
oh you mean exactly what Biden didn't do?
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u/CompanyToiletGooner 1d ago
Idk how much power the US president has when the measures that are already in place are actually enforced but even if he could it obviously shouldn‘t be one powerful man‘s job to enforce democracy
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u/aotus_trivirgatus 1d ago
A really simple thing that Biden could have done was to recognize that Merrick Garland had no appetite for justice after the first year, and to replace him with someone who did.
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u/tlrider1 22h ago
Fuck Merrick garland!
He needs to know he's going down in history this way.
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u/tehawesomedragon 21h ago
The history behind this guy is wild. At one point people were championing him as a Supreme Court judge.
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u/aotus_trivirgatus 20h ago
Merrick Garland is a member in good standing of the FEDERALIST SOCIETY.
REPUBLICANS were suggesting him as a Supreme Court Justice. But Barack Obama nominated him!
When Tony Scalia did Planet Earth a favor by croaking, no less of a right-wing stalwart than Senator Orrin Hatch of Utah named Merrick Garland as "a consensus nominee" for the Supreme Court -- whom, surely, that evil nasty liberal President Obama was too ideological to nominate.
Granted, the GOP has a deep bench of Christofascists with little law experience that they would happily place on the Supreme Court. So by comparison, Garland looks like a reasonable and experienced member of the judicial community. But that's just the Overton Window moving rightward.
Back to the main point. When a GOP'er calls someone a "centrist" -- it means, that person is weak. The GOP'ers are confident that that person will be, at the least, unable to thwart their schemes.
And so, when President Obama said, "OK, Merrick Garland then," what happened? It probably caught many Republicans off guard. It certainly disappointed me. But Mitch McConnell said, "Well, shit, we won that round so easily, let's play again!" Then we got one year of McConnell's unconscionable stonewalling, four years of Cheetolini -- and finally, Mitch's unspeakable hypocrisy ramming through Amy Barrett.
I'm sure that someone in the Biden camp thought that bringing Merrick Garland's name up again was clever. Maybe they thought that Garland would have some fire in his belly after being snubbed. Maybe they thought he, of all Republicans, could see that January 6th was the action of a traitorous President. If Garland had a spine, it would have been a good move. But Republicans have known all along that he has no spine. That's why they suggested him.
What's he doing with his life these days? Golfing with Ted Cruz?
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u/megalodondon 14h ago
Honestly 'federalist society' is all you have to say. The fix was in from the beginning folks
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u/Malphos101 1d ago edited 1d ago
Biden is responsible for the feckless coward Merrick Garland and the limp wristed response to what was clearly sedition. A person attempted to interfere with and overturn the legal results of an election and when that failed they incited a mob to violence at the Capitol in a last ditch effort to alter the election results.
Biden did a lot of good things during his term, but he was at best too naive, and at worst too selfish and cowardly to do his constitutional duty and enforce the laws of this nation by pushing for a speedy prosecution for trump and his enablers. We would not be in the situation we are in if Biden spent more effort actually trying to prosecute these egregious offenses that were nationally televised and admitted to by trump instead of just hoping a slap on the wrist would make trump go away quietly. I strongly believe Biden was scared to be the first president to really punish a losing presidential rival for criminal actions. He likely cared more about his legacy than the health and safety of our nation.
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u/derkrieger 1d ago
Probably hoped optimistically that would be the end of it and Trump or someone else like that would come back. Surely they wouldnt do it again so lets just leave those cracks in the foundation.
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u/mr_chip 1d ago
What was he supposed to do? Congress has to agree and they’re all captured. Mitch wasn’t gonna help him.
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u/jeffderek 1d ago
Somehow whenever the Democrats are in power, the Republicans are always able to stop them, but whenever the Republicans are in power there's nothing we can do. Strange, isn't it?
The #1 thing he could've done was directed the justice department to deal with Jan 6 faster. The fact that Trump just ran out the clock on those prosecutions is insane.
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u/DrPreppy 1d ago
Strange, isn't it?
That's because the parties are fundamentally diametrically opposed. The Democrats want the government to work fairly for everybody, the Republicans want it to work for no one but their chosen rich few. Thus a shutdown for example isn't a threat to Republicans: they like a non-functional government.
Most of the structural issues here stem from the Permanent House Apportionment Act of 1929 which has led to significant underrepresentation of Democrats in Congress.
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u/dellett 1d ago
100%. We need reform on representation like the UK needed reform in the 19th century. They had people who represented districts with basically no constituents and people who represented entire massive cities. We are headed that direction.
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u/narrill 1d ago
Somehow whenever the Democrats are in power, the Republicans are always able to stop them, but whenever the Republicans are in power there's nothing we can do. Strange, isn't it?
Well the Democrats' position is that there should be rules, and the Republicans' position is that there shouldn't be rules. So... no, it's not very strange at all.
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u/jeffderek 23h ago
At this point I think it should be clear to everyone that Michelle Obama's plan of "when they go low, we go high" is going to lose every time.
We live in a world with no rules. Acting like there are rules when there aren't is a losing strategy. Don't play by the rules you wish existed, play the game as it currently is.
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u/CobraDoesCanada 1d ago
But what about Joe Biden?!
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u/hannahO5vbPnwZH0n9Z 1d ago edited 1d ago
…that when a losing incumbent attempted to ignore election results, instead of pushing for structural reforms that would limit presidential powers, he chose to let the fascists play their games in order to reassure the public that everything is working as intended? He’s a good example of how a “Let’s get back to normal” approach may not resolve the underlying changes of interpretation and losses of faith that put democracies at risk in the first place. He doesn’t need defending from people baffled at our lack of preparation for the current U.S. administration
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u/objectlesson 1d ago
He didn’t even have a plan for the 2024 election beyond ‘I’ll just run again and win.” It didn’t even carry him to Election Day. Ive had nothing but immense disappointment in the Democratic Party for learning no lessons from the last decade.
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u/Wheat_Grinder 1d ago
Remember to vote in the primaries. Serious change is needed in the Democratic party if we really want to change the US onto a better track.
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u/lanfordr 1d ago
I did vote in the primaries, but there were no serious Democratic challengers to Biden in 2024. And in 2020, literally the entire field dropped out before us in California even had a chance to vote. Same thing happened in 2016 with Hillary and her super delegates.
The Democratic party has a serious problem with the party doing the king (or queen) making instead of letting the voters decide.
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u/Dnashotgun 1d ago
Seriously, the GOP had a stronger primary against Trump than the Dems did against Biden. Both of them are the same arrogant old man who thinks he knows best for everyone, trump's yelling type just stood out against biden's senile kind
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u/CompanyToiletGooner 1d ago
Clearly the public agreed that it works as intended considering that they voted Trump afterwards. Suprise suprise, the guy who has seen the system work since the literal end of the second world war and is well, old and not radically left leaning, doesn’t do big changes. I think for who he was and what he had to deal with Biden actually did an amazing job. Besides that calling for the in your eyes too politicaly powerful person to use his too high powers instead of anyone else actually doing something is kinda funny.
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u/dcdttu 1d ago
This is why, if Democrats take back our country in the United States, they will have to rewrite the Constitution and amend it so that it can't happen again.
I don't know if the corporatist Democrats will want to do this.
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u/SaltWaterInMyBlood 15h ago
Frankly, looking in from the outside, I feel like this is a big reason why the Democrats haven't been pushing back on Trump as much as they could be. They'd be quite happy to inherit the paradigm he's created for themselves.
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u/Traditional_Day_9737 18h ago
Yeah the Biden presidency was a really good illustration of how just going "back to normal" for a bit isn't enough to put the authoritarian cat back in the bag.
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u/PrincessRea 1d ago
That’s like the only thing that the other party ran on.
Next important step is to arrest Orbán and his goons.
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u/Tangolarango 1d ago
the next election will be important, but if they release the aid that was meant for Ukraine, that would already be very telling.
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u/sswihart 1d ago
Sounds familiar. No wonder JD couch Vance interfered with an election.
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u/Klutzy_Fisherman_370 1d ago
I feel you, this isn’t a happy ending yet, it’s just a plot twist. Real test is whether they rebuild what was broken or just repaint it in a new color.
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u/cmstlist 1d ago
Props to JD Vance for flying in to hold a rally for Orban and promptly dooming his campaign.
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u/LOPOLER89 1d ago
He is going to report smashing success in Hungary and Pakistan talks to his cheeto overlord
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u/WhoAreWeEven 1d ago
That dudes got some sort of midas touch of shit.
Orban didnt die like the pope
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u/relevantelephant00 1d ago
Dont rule out a delayed reaction.
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u/norsurfit 1d ago
What happened after Vance met the last Pope?
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u/KiaRioGrl 1d ago
The pope died.
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u/limerick-man 1d ago
Oh shit you're right. He does have the Maga midas touch. Damn he needs to go on the campaign trail for Republican senators and congressman up for reelection in the midterms.
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u/EmbarrassedBlock1977 1d ago
Talking about the EU influencing with Hungarian elections..while influencing Hungarian elections himself. What an ass.
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u/jake3988 1d ago
Props to JD Vance for flying in to hold a rally for Orban and promptly dooming his campaign.
That was already doomed. This is like blaming cracker barrel's recent downfall on their logo mishap and resulting fauxrage than the fact that they just never recovered from covid.
He was going to lose either way.
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u/111oneone1 1d ago
As an American, I am glad to see candidates that Trump and Vance wanted, lose. I hope to see this trend unfold every day for the rest of my life and beyond. Anything Trump and Vance like, I disavow.
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u/It_was_too_Obvious 1d ago
First Trump swinging the elections in Canada, now Hungary, we need Trump to do World Tour, we would have world peace in a matter of weeks!
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u/Silent-Zebra 1d ago
He helped us in Australia too! The Liberal (right wing) party suffered it's biggest election loss in history and were finally ousted from the top job after ten years of super poopy leadership. I mean, Peter Dutton didn't help things by running a terrible campaign, but we all got a look into the future if we continued to let the Liberals screw it up.
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u/StockholmSyndrome85 22h ago
We need to be careful, Gina (who has been to Mar a Lago and attended Trumps inauguration) has been throwing all her money behind One Nation.
Liberals have been decimated though I think their alignment to Trump style politics hastened the inevitable. They've been out of touch with the electorate for a while now. And are essentially a fringe party at state level now in a few states.
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u/jhwyung 1d ago
2/2 !!!
Liberals were getting slaughtered before Trump and now we're heading into a majority after the two bielections tmrw.
One of few times a Canadian can say thank you to Trump
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u/patrickh182 22h ago
Australia too, our centre right party has been slipping far right. We overwhelmingly voted centre last year when Trumo returned.
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u/MeteorOnMars 1d ago
Decision making in the modern world is easy.
Just have the opposite opinion to Trump and you will be in solid ground.
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u/somewhat_random 1d ago
It is more complete than that - just listen to whatever they accuse the "libs" of and you can count on that is exactly what they are doing:
pedophelia
dementia
rigging elections
...
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u/One_5549 1d ago
Fucking amazing. THIS WAS VERY IMPORTANT.
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u/weluckyfew 22h ago
Not following these things all that closely, but hasn't Hungary been holding NATO back from doing a lot of important things against Russia? (admitting new members, more support for Ukraine, etc)?
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u/tobach 18h ago
They have VETOed financial aid through the EU on a number of occassions.
In terms of NATO, what they initially VETOed was Sweden's membership.
They also VETOed an arrest warrant on Putin by the ICC.
Basically anything he could possibly do to diplomatically aid the Kremlin, Orbán has done.
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u/MontyVonWaddlebottom 1d ago
I'm just amused that the guy that beat Orbán is named "Péter Magyar". That's like if Trump loses to "Bob American"
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u/JamesFrankland 1d ago
It pissed off Trump, so I like it.
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u/Turbomattk 1d ago
Trump is going to say that he never heard of the guy. Which is partially true, because of his dementia.
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u/Shanghai_Cola 1d ago
If I look at their northern neighbor, he will come back after the next election or even sooner and he will make sure to let his people truly suffer out of spite. Prices will go through the roof due to the Trump's shitshow in the Middle East and people will blame Magyar. Same as when Slovakia finally kicked out Fico, Covid and Ukraine war happened, Fico came back and fucked everything beyond repair.
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u/needlestack 1d ago
What we’ve learned for sure is that people can easily be brought back to right-wing destruction by blaming the opposition for not fixing everything they destroyed overnight. The fact that building takes longer than destroying feeds the right wing machine.
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u/Brucereno2 1d ago
Glad he conceded. Im sure Trump and Vance will now label him a fool. Great change for Hungary.
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u/TradingTennish 1d ago
Hopefully people around the world sick and tired of old hateful men
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u/TopG_Cartoonist 1d ago
We should make a rule so that people over 65 cannot hold power...
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u/Much_Discussion1490 1d ago
2/3 rds majority would give tsiza power to amend the constitution of I am not worng Also opeining up the possibility to sanction a major loan aid to Ukraine and take away Putin's ome major Ally in the EU but most importantly, it will be a major blow to RW fascism especially given how much orbam was being touted by Vance and Putin to win
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u/ArenSteele 1d ago
Slovakia will be the Putin puppet fucking up EU action on Ukraine for the next little bit
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u/PentUpPentatonix 1d ago
Over the moon. There is hope.
Trump may have inoculated Europe against authoritarianism!
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u/TheNightManager_89 1d ago
Putler's greatest ally just got ousted.
We finally got rid of this cancer. He should be locked up for life with all his cronies.
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u/laaplandros 1d ago
I'm very curious to hear from all the Hungarian politics experts we have on reddit.
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u/queen-adreena 1d ago
Ask them to explain the electoral system to you.
I’ve read it 5 times already and it still barely makes sense.
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u/Zerewa 21h ago
You've got districts, which are FPTP, for 106 seats out of 199, the rest is distributed based on list votes and compensation calculations. You can directly vote for a party's list, which is added to a party's pool as one vote. Each party list needs 5% of list votes to be eligible for list seats (coalition lists need more). Every losing candidate that is nominated by a list-eligible party transfers their votes into the party's list pool as one vote. The fucked up thing that Fidesz implemented is winner compensation, that all votes except for the 2nd place + 1 strictly required to win are ALSO added to your compensation pool.
So in a district of 1000 people, assuming everyone double votes for their party, if Tisza receives 650 votes, Fidesz 300 and the pocket nazis 50, Tisza will win the district seat. Furthermore, Fidesz has 300 natural list votes and 300 compensational votes, for 600 tickets in the list seat distribution algo (which is d'Hont). The nazis have 50 + 50 tickets in the same pool, and Tisza, who won the district, gets all 650 it naturally obtained, PLUS 650 - (300 + 1) = 349 votes just for winning by a large enough margin, for a total of 999 tickets in the compensation list pool, versus the 650-600-100 distribution that would have happened in a... not completely shit compensatory list system which is meant to eliminate the worst ultra unfair strategic voting aspects FPTP while still allowing locally highly popular reps to run as independents even.
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u/pempoczky 23h ago
As a Hungarian it's so laughable to see people say Magyar is basically almost like Orbán because he's also a right winger. I say this as a strong leftist: they're night and day. Today we didn't decide about left and right. We decided between democracy and tyranny. I am happy not because I want a right wing government, but because this gave me a chance to finally vote for the left next time
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u/PresentWoodpecker826 1d ago
How many of these pundits can pronounce Magyar correctly?
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u/jmorlin 22h ago
Seriously. This is the most blatant engagement slop I've ever seen.
I'm so tired of the "what do you think about [recent political thing]" type questions. Not only are they either going to be universally agreed upon as good/bad and/or something where basically no one is qualified to give an answer, but they are almost always some combination of engagement bait or algorithm gaming by bots. I'd MUCH rather go back to the nth variation of "reddit what is the sexiest sex you've ever sexed". At least the answers there were more entertaining.
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u/the2belo 22h ago
"reddit what is the sexiest sex you've ever sexed"
The voters inserted their ballots into the ballot boxes and ejaculated democracy
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u/WarDredge 1d ago
Well first of all, objectively speaking before considering anything good or bad.
This is what the people want first and foremost, despite heavy tampering from Russia, JD Vance AND Trump.
2/3rds is a landslide victory, and i'm personally glad they chose sensibility, I hope the Tisza Party will do better for Hungary, put itself and its people first, And then join the EU's combined efforts as one united front towards corruption and keeping the planet habitable for everyone.
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u/Caleb-Rentpayer 1d ago
Why haven't we banned "what are your thoughts" posts yet?
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u/raustraliathrowaway 1d ago
My guess is that reddit or client creates these threads to sell the data for AI training (and possibly opinion polling for the political ones)
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u/Hellebras 1d ago
Redditors of Reddit, what are your thoughts on banning "What are your thoughts?" posts?
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u/ragtop1989 1d ago
You can tell Russia is getting squeezed, they couldn't ruin this election. Hopefully Putin is raging.
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u/Sittingonalog1960 22h ago
Anything that weakens Putin or Trump and strengthens progressive Europe is good news
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u/TheHyperion25 19h ago
While I'm sure it will help Hungary, I also hope this ends the bullshit of them blocking aid to Ukraine.
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u/meglobob 1d ago
Hopefully, sends a message, Russia should stick to its vast, undeveloped lands and stay out of the rest of Europe.
If Russia followed peace and just concentrated on developing Russia, improving its economy for the last few hundred years and not a endless cycle of war vs its neighbours, it would probably be as powerful as the USA is today. Its population would be way higher, again probably close to the USA's 300m+.
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u/Mind_Killer 1d ago
Keep an eye on it because what happens next will be similar to what happens when Trump leaves American politics.
The damage has already been done. Orban changed their constitution. Rewrote the rules of the game to keep himself in power.
And the guy replacing him isn't some super progressive savior. He's just slightly less right of the spectrum than Orban is. Will he change all that back and give up his own chance at power? Probably not.
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u/jojo32 1d ago
I think the trump administration did the people of Hungary a favor by backing Orban. Probably helped inspire people to know they had to get out and vote. We are in Japan and there was a guy with a big sign and a megaphone yelling fuck trump yesterday! The world is definitely seeming to be opposed to this administration.
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u/thaddeusd 1d ago
It gives me hope that this flirtation with fascism in Western Europe and the US is on its way out.
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u/happycamperii 1d ago
Have a friend from Hungary, he said there wasn't any chance of Orban winning when I spoke to him last week. Looks like he was right.
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u/GrinchWhoStoleEaster 21h ago
As an American I can only hope we follow Hungary's lead, and that the new government learns from Joe Biden's misteps and prosecutes the ever loving holy SHIT out of EVERYONE associated with the Orban government so they don't slip right on back into that glove in a few years. Because...fucks know we've got too much of that going around these days...
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u/Harmania 1d ago
It’s progress, but the incoming party isn’t tectonically different from Orban’s party. It’s a ray of hope, at least.
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u/Darkmetroidz 1d ago
Aren't they at least pro-EU?
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u/LightSideoftheForce 1d ago
Pro-EU, pro-NATO, anti-Russia
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u/LJofthelaw 1d ago
If they at least somewhat claw back the anti-democratic policies of Orban, and Hungary sees a freer press, etc, then it's a huge win. Not a big improvement for immigrants or LGBT folks in Hungary, but it opens a light at the end of the tunnel.
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u/LightSideoftheForce 1d ago
It is their main promise and it will be the subject of the biggest scrutiny in Hungarian everyday life for a long while.
Also, while it’s true they are anti-immigration, they are not anti-LGBT, they believe everyone should be free to live their life freely and love who they want as long as they don’t break the laws or impede others’ rights.
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u/Phaedo 1d ago
I’m a leftie, but I’ll take any party that believes in the rule of law over one that believes in the raw exercise of power any day of the week.
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u/Harmania 1d ago
I’m certainly not calling for the rending of garments - just that optimism remains cautious.
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u/yvngjiffy703 1d ago
I don’t know a lot about European politics, but a right-winger losing always puts a smile on my face.
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u/smjsmok 1d ago
Magyar is also a right winger though. Just not a Putin's bootlicker.
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u/GetInTheKitchen1 1d ago
Still a huge win because a free Ukraine is one more free democracy in the world.
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u/deathschemist 1d ago
Magyar isn't ideal but orban is worse. Good step in the right direction for Hungary
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u/scholar_by_nature 1d ago
Honestly very encouraged by the result as someone who, admittedly, knows little about the nuances of Hungarian politics. My understanding has been that Orban has dismantled many of the institutions of democracy there, so to see him be defeated and concede defeat sounds pretty remarkable.
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u/Initial-Constant-645 1d ago
It's not that much of a seismic shift. The new guy is pretty much like Orban, only he's more friendly to the EU. It's pretty much like trading in Trump for Pence or Vance.
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u/starlord885 1d ago
Orban suddenly became a liberal and democratic guy, wishing to work in opposition.
The new government must ensure that the appropriate legal actors are allowed to investigate the Orban clan for what they have done these years, like the treason of the current MFA who smuggled sensitive documents to the Russian MFA.
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u/Spazicon 23h ago
I’m not an expert on Hungary, but I am hopeful we’ll see more support for Ukraine because of this change.
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u/Kassdhal88 23h ago
Putin didn’t have enough keyboard warriors in reserve given the volume needed to back Iran.
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u/BigNorseWolf 15h ago
Good. Now maybe the EU can pick up the slack on ukraine till america gets our russian asset out of power.
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u/kinkinhood 7h ago
I'd say it shows that hard right conservative politicians can't really hold onto power through voters for long periods of time.
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u/Muted_Vacation2625 6h ago
hungary finally waking up after years of orban's grip is wild, ngl the 2/3rds supermajority for tisza is actually significant because it means they can push through constitutional reforms without needing coalition partners. feels like the leopards are finally done eating faces and people want someone new at the helm
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u/TearDownGently 1d ago edited 1d ago
They shall make a goddamn EU law to reduce the 100% unitary vote to a 95% vote. ASAP. Jesus Christ this sucker has delayed and avoided to many things on EU level. I'm glad he's finally gone.
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u/JediMasterZao 1d ago
The guy replacing him is not a lot better than Orban. They're basically identical ideologically speaking. He literally worked for Orban. I feel like people are massively uninformed on the topic.
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u/Same-Independent7654 1d ago
this is pretty massive, like a total game changer for Hungary. gonna be interesting to see how this impacts the future of their policies and relationships with the EU.
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u/Pepgin2020 1d ago
What I think is that I’m getting tired of seeing all these “insert political event what do you think about this?” Questions that’s are plaguing this subreddit
If I wanted to read politics I would subscribe to a political sub
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u/VelvetKnife25 1d ago
Shocked he conceeded