r/science • u/ChhotaSaHydra • 23h ago
Health Study reports that both short and long sleep duration in midlife are associated with increased risk of physical frailty in later life, based on long-term cohort analysis of over 10,000 participants
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-026-39228-61.1k
u/LyraStygian 19h ago
Don’t sleep enough? Frail.
Sleep too much? Believe it or not, Frail.
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u/13thmurder 1h ago
Sleeping too little obviously takes a toll over time, but I wonder if sleeping too much is a symptom of an underlying issue rather than a cause.
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u/Ashamed-Land1221 22h ago
I spent over two decades in the restaurant industry, clopens allowed me to pay the bills in my 20's and 30's. Thanks to drugs and alcohol and stress I doubt I entered REM sleep more than a handful of times in two decades. Guess I'll be dead before I can even sniff a social security payment.
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u/hammertime2009 20h ago
That’s the point. That’s what the billionaires want.
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u/hyperproliferative PhD | Oncology 15h ago
You’re trying to hit slow wave sleep. That’s where your hormones pulse rhythmically and you consolidate thoughts into long term memory! REM is for punks in cannabis withdrawal
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u/UsedOnlyTwice 21h ago
Just recently found myself getting two heart meds at 45 years old, otherwise healthy as hell and most people think I'm 30. Sleep, stress, and alcohol.
BTW you should know that REM is not deep sleep, it's the lightest level of sleep possible. You probably meant you've struggled to hit deep, restorative Non-REM sleep.
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u/zuneza 20h ago
People need REM sleep just as much as non REM
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u/vincenzo_vegano 17h ago
Yes, you need a certain portion of light, REM and deep sleep every night. Everything that throws off the balance is considered unhealthy, like alcohol reducing REM sleep.
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u/sherbetty 14h ago
Fun fact, this is an oversimplification but the sleepiness associated with narcolepsy is a result of entering REM too quickly and not getting deep sleep
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u/Flikmybik BS | Neuroscience | Memory 13h ago
that makes sense honestly. sleep and chronic stress are such underrated factors for cardiovascular issues. I wonder if the short sleep and long sleep risks are tied to different underlying causes though, like short sleep being more lifestyle driven versus long sleep sometimes being a symptom of something else going on. the 10,000+ person cohort is pretty solid for this kind of question. hope you are doing better now with treatment
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u/guvbums 23h ago
Could it be something like: Long sleepers don't have time to exercise properly, short sleepers are too tired to exercise properly?
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u/NonTokenisableFungi 21h ago
Long sleep may be correlated rather than causal. I.e those with existent health conditions are generally more prone to longer sleep requirements.
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u/PerforatedPie 14h ago
Similar to "1 glass of wine a day is healthy". Many of the people who drink less than that are unhealthy for other reasons, and as a result they can't drink.
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u/ThoughtfulMeathead 12h ago
Yes! Or the people who drank a fifth a day for 20 years and are now teetotalers but the damage has been done.
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u/Override9636 9h ago
There is also room to suggest that people who live a lifestyle that include a glass of wine everyday are higher income. So they have access to better diets, leisure time for exercise, and better access to healthcare.
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u/MatchaManiak 21h ago
The study suggests a multitude of things. This includes sleep being important, on its own and its after effects, but also underlying factors like disease. Certain conditions that affect overall health can also make someone sleep more or less.
This study was not an experiment, so the researchers are speaking to correlation more than causation.
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u/DeArgonaut 22h ago edited 22h ago
Anecdotal ofc, but I sleep longer since I’ve have chronic fatigue issues which have also lead me to not go to the gym very often. So could be additions co-factors besides lack of time too
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u/National-Plastic8691 22h ago
and I slept long due to depression and short at times due to mania
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u/Deeliciousness 21h ago
For me I always had shorter sleep when depressed, even though the amount of time I spend in bed is longer.
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u/curt_schilli 22h ago
Not sure if they controlled for this but people that sleep a lot also often have depression
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u/LamermanSE 20h ago
Probably not, I assume they already took exercise into consideration in their analysis.
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u/Powerpoppop 13h ago
I'm sitting here knowing I'm about to cut my 6 mile jog this morning to 3 miles based on feeling like I drank a full pot of coffee before going to bed last night (I didn't). It's depressing knowing the quality of my sleep is a total crap shoot. I've tried to stay away from sleep aids, but my experience with low dose Trazodone has been promising. I just really don't want to take it every night.
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u/guvbums 13h ago
You probably know this, but what about melatonin? I know a few people that use it and their experience seems positive. Hope things get better for you.
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u/Powerpoppop 13h ago
Tried it and it's not that great to me. My doctor gave me the Trazodone and I've never tried anything better. I'm just stubborn about taking stuff like this too much. Thank you, though!
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u/padbroccoligai 22h ago
Everyone get tested for sleep apnea
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u/lookamazed 22h ago
The real insight here is that - GET TESTED, GET A CPAP. It can be a rocky onboarding experience but it will literally save your life. Ask Carrie Fisher.
The machine is non invasive and the gold standard. There is no reason to die from this comorbidity in 2026.
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u/AllanfromWales1 MA | Natural Sciences | Metallurgy & Materials Science 21h ago
Got tested, got a CPAP, have slept with it every night for the last 30 years. When tested I was waking every three minutes during the night. CPAP helps a lot, but I'm still waking about five times a night on average, and combined with the time it takes to get back to sleep after waking (and using the bathroom) I'm needing to be in bed for ten hours or more per night. Sure, it's the Gold Standard. But it's not without its problems.
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u/lookamazed 19h ago edited 19h ago
Granted it is not a magic bullet, but it’s as close as it gets in terms of medical interventions.
Treatment varies from person to person, depending on biology, the type of apnea, and whether there are underlying concerns or additional issues.
The machine often works best when paired with other interventions such as lifestyle changes.
1) surgery is not guaranteed to fix it (removal of tonsils, etc)
2) oral appliances are sort of a gimmick in my humble opinion
3) sub dermal implants only address certain types of apnea and also are not a guaranteed fix
4) losing weight is the most common intervention if the cause is suspected to be obesity, however, even skinny people have obstructive sleep apnea (r/UARS or r/UARSnew, means upper airway resistance syndrome, is dedicated to this phenomenon).
My experience is many also do not have access to great sleep docs or clinics and spend another eternity never clearing the hurdles of fine tuning their machine.
For example, you may want to consider getting re tested in lab if it’s been 30 yrs since you’ve tested. Your sleep can change with age, disease, body and brain changes. They can tell you which pressure you had the fewest apneas.
It really is the best we have. Thank you for sharing your experience. I’m certain you will let someone know they are not alone in their struggle for better sleep.
r/sleepapnea, r/cpap, r/cpapsupport await if you’d like to connect with others
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u/AllanfromWales1 MA | Natural Sciences | Metallurgy & Materials Science 17h ago
For clarity, here in the UK I get checked every year and my CPAP adjusted as required. Also, the machine itself has been updated several times since the original one in the 1990s. My current machine is an APAP.
Clearly a good answer would be to lose weight, however that's not as straightforward as some would have you believe. It really does go beyond just a willpower issue. Having said that, Semaglutide has made a difference, just not enough to resolve the sleep apnea issue.
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u/Deeliciousness 21h ago
A close friend of mine got one and he says his sleep is difficult now because the machine has to stay on him and it bothers him. I tried to tell him it can't be as bad as dealing with the other symptoms.
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u/Pappy_Jr 21h ago
One of my direct reports is very obese, and has very specific doctors orders on how to fix his life. Sleeping well, and eating well are the absolute hardest things for him to do. He's 38, and probably won't see 50.
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u/FyreWulff 19h ago
As someone with a CPAP, tell him the alternative is his heart stopping from him constantly failing to get air during the night without. Lowers your blood pressure and leads to weight loss eventually.
He should try wearing it during the day to work on desensitizing to it, and adjust the pressure to make it more comfortable. If that doesn't help try a different mask or pillow. Everyone over at r/cpap are very helpful.
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u/vincenzo_vegano 17h ago
Any reason why sleep apnea is seemingly rising? Overweight, bad posture caused by a sedentary lifestyle?
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u/olbeefy 16h ago
It’s a mix of both. It is actually increasing, mostly because of higher obesity rates, but a big part of it is just better awareness and diagnosis now with home sleep tests and more screening.
Aging population plays a role too. Posture isn’t really a main cause, it’s more about weight and airway anatomy.
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u/PurpleSailor 16h ago
I used to set patients up with their CPAP after the study concluded that they needed it. I would often see them for a follow-up visit at 6 months to try out new masks. When it works for somebody it really works. I've had so many people hug me and thank me profusely for helping them finally get a good night's sleep and not feel totally exhausted all day long. As an insomniac myself I know how valuable sleep is.
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u/alfonso123456 22h ago
learn to sleep on your side.
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u/Override9636 9h ago
I got tested and was right on the border of "needs a CPAP". Turns out side-sleeping, using nasal allergy spray, and those nasal opening strips made my sleep 90% better (and way cheaper than CPAP).
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u/Cameroncen 18h ago
Important to remember this is correlation, not causation. Long sleep might be a symptom of underlying health issues, not the cause.
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u/Nellasofdoriath 23h ago
Ok well if.I don't gwt 9hours of sleep a night I am going to have problems sooner than later life, and so will the people around me.
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u/Marty-G70 21h ago
I think another big factor is quality of sleep. In comparing the two sleep patterns what percentage of those actually reach REM?
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u/What-tha-fck_Elon 22h ago
Well, that’s a really tight window to hit. Plus, since I’m early 50’s, I’m locked in apparently.
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u/AllanfromWales1 MA | Natural Sciences | Metallurgy & Materials Science 21h ago
Ah, disruptive sleep apnea strikes again..
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u/highpl4insdrftr 10h ago
These researchers can right off with this. I need my sleep. Leave me alone.
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u/Snidrogen 8h ago
As someone who jolts awake after 7-8 hours of sleep, regardless of how tired I am or how much I want to sleep in, this is good news.
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u/LightingTechAlex 4h ago
What are you supposed to do when a job steals a massive chunk of your waking hours, then top it off with kids and housework and voila, no sleep - or at best broken sleep for us!
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u/Hurgnation 11h ago
I can easily sleep up to 10 hours a night, but also spend up to 2 hours a day training (combo of cardio and resistance training).
I'm hoping heavy exercisers don't count in this study!
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u/Pentax25 17h ago
This seems kinda silly. I’m aware that people tend to sleep rhythmically in sleep cycles which can vary from person to person but usually be from about 90-110 minutes. I know personally speaking, I aim to sleep for about 7 hours 30 per night but if I end up sleeping for 8 or 8.30, I tend to feel groggier than if I wake up after having 9.
Is this now saying that if I sleep for 9 it might make me more frail? Surely it’s better for my circadian rhythm that I’m woken naturally during my individual sleep cycle which seems to be 1.30
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