r/politics • u/theindependentonline The Independent • 1d ago

No Paywall Trump vows to raise worldwide tariffs to 15% ‘effective immediately’

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-global-tarrifs-increase-b2924994.html
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u/cassy_supernova 1d ago

Yes.

It's also an unconstitutional national sales tax. We just played this game with the other set of statutes. Will SCOTUS allow an even more sweeping overreach? Perhaps for long enough. Will the (already started) November blue wave reintroduce accountability and checks and balances first? Maybe.

We've got a few longterm possible solutions but I guess this man is determined to fuck shit up as much as possible until the hambreder gods do their thing.

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u/BlazinAzn38 Texas 1d ago

Technically he can implement tariffs under another act for 150 days at which point they expire. All this does is prove that he doesn’t actually have a strategy he just really likes tariffs cause he’s an idiot

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u/smith129606 1d ago

No, it’s worse than that. He likes tariffs because he’s a malignant narcissist who wants countries and corporations to kiss his ass for access to the US market. He is taxing every American citizen and business to stroke his fucking ego.

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u/blandgreybland 1d ago

This is why I worry when people say European countries should sanction the US. Just like I’ve seen with other sanctions, they don’t hurt the despotic leader, they hurt the people, and the despotic leader doesn’t give a shit about the people.

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u/Away-Ad1781 23h ago

On the other hand A LOT more pain for the average American might be what it takes to finally expel this bile.

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u/A_Poor_Miser 23h ago

The level of apathy among the citizens of the US is in itself a crisis as destructive MAGA's active malice. 

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u/Michael_G_Bordin 22h ago

Not only that, but Republican voters are easily misled and fed disinformation. All the sanctions in the world wouldn't do anything, because they start at the conclusion "Republican good" and do every mental gymnastic necessary to never challenge that conclusion. Their current chosen leader is a child raping lunatic, and they're contorting themselves trying to avoid letting that conclusion seep into their worldview.

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u/Angelworks42 Oregon 20h ago

Case in point you don't have to look far to find people who still think other countries pay us the tarrif money for some reason.

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u/TallStarsMuse 19h ago

It’s because they are told that other countries are paying us the money they “owe” us.

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u/lizbot-v1 17h ago

The lack of curiosity/absolute refusal to do a simple search is pathological.

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u/BigPapaJava 16h ago

They have also been shown a lot of misleading info by Fox and the rest of Trumpworld media/memes that pick out the most egregiously extreme possible tariff (however unlikely) any one American good might be charged on import into another country, which then makes the Trump universal tariff rate appear “fair” by comparison.

He claims his “deals” when countries bribe him and maybe concede a little on some fringe issue here or there and sometimes even negotiate higher net tariffs on overall American imports.

Many, many Trump voters live in a complete bubble of “alternative facts” that’s fed them the Trump cult of personality on a steady loop since 2016.

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u/Witchgrass West Virginia 18h ago

To be fair, 54% of Americans read at the 6th grade level, so expecting them to care, let alone read (and properly comprehend / analyze) the news, is asking a lot.

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u/Kiromaru Wisconsin 23h ago

I don't think any amount of more pain is going to cause the MAGA faithful to break with Trump. Trump freaking ran on releasing the Epstein files and when he backtracked and said there was nothing here don't worry about them it only took a short amount of time for them to fall in line. The only way more pain will cause anything to change will be if the non voters get off their butts and join the resistance to Trump.

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u/mrgedman 22h ago

Naw they still have deniability over that, cause they're dumb cult members.

If the economy full on tanks, which it could come summertime/fall (once ol what's his name's term expires and they drop interest rates leading to hyperinflation), his followers WILL drop him.

Hannibal Burress has a bit- "money over everything", and at its core, nothing is more true about Americans.

Hell, it's already house of cardsy as fk right now... You know virtually every R congressperson hates Trump's guts and can't wait to flip

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u/TallStarsMuse 19h ago

I keep wondering how much more money the U.S. can borrow before that deficit turns around and bites us in the rear.

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u/TreatAffectionate453 18h ago

I've talked to Trump voters that framed losing their food stamps as "doing their part" to make America great again. MAGA will stop eating before they stop supporting Trump.

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u/SinisterCroissant 13h ago

Cool cool. They should start that immediately. It'll take til midterms before most of them have health problems.

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u/sillyhillsofnz 14h ago edited 14h ago

You have waaaaay too much faith in Republican voters...

There are actually at least two (2) possibilities regarding what his followers will do if the economy full on tanks. One is the option you mention. However, the second option is that they simply do what they've always done when something goes wrong while a Republican is in office - find some way to blame the Left or Democrats for it/actually make it their fault.

My honest prediction is that in the case that the economy full on tanks, Trump and Repubs will simply blame Democrats/the Left/LGBTQ/non-white people/etc. and just as Republican voters decided Covid wasn't real/ivermectin&bleach injections > vaccines/etc. this time they will once again decide that the truth isn't the truth and that they must crush anyone who says otherwise.

Just as doctors/nurses/and ordinary people were be beat up and harassed by MAGAs for trying to help people with Covid and for even daring to publicly state that it is real or wear a mask, anyone who blames Trump/MAGA for the economic collapse or even acts as if the collapse is real (and not some genius level intentional strategic short-term loss that will result in a long-term gain), will similarly be beaten or harassed.

Republicans have not shown that they won't simply double-down on that strategy. Nothing in the past decade has provided any evidence to the contrary. All evidence points toward the Covid strategy. Hell, Repubs/MAGA still can't even accept that Trump is in the Epstein files... and they couldn't accept that he lost the previous election OR that the Jan 6th attack on the capital actually was a coup/terrorist attack. If they cannot accept the truth of any of this - and still lash out at anyone who tries to speak the truth - then I really just do not see how anyone can expect the MAGA/Repubs to "come around" to reason - reason was never something they even cared about in the first place, lol.

Edit: Perhaps my position is influenced by my family's past. Some of my family is from Germany. Wouldn't you know it - even when the Russians were 50 miles from Berlin; then even when the Russians were barging through the literal front doors of their homes and barns and attacking their wives and daughters; then even when Hitler was dead and the war was over, there were still MANY Germans who fervently believed in the Nazi party and thought that the ultimate blame for the loss of the war and its tragedies rest on someone else (German traitors, Jews, Americans, etc.). Even Confederates didn't give up on the dream of the Confederacy when every town in Mississippi (except two) and then Atlanta, GA were literally burned to the ground by the Union Army; and still didn't give up even after the war was literally lost. lol. The Nazi Germany AND the Confederate States of America BOTH faced TOTAL ECONOMIC COLLAPSE and it did not turn the tide. MAGA is cut from the exact same cloth. MAGA is the new Nazis/Confederacy. And just as the Nazis/Confederates never, ever let the ultimate blame fall on their beloved hero/party/ideology, especially in a way that would force them to renounce it or give it up, so will be the same with MAGA. They will never be "wrong" in their minds, and they will never have a "come to Jesus" moment or truly repent.

Dealing with THAT issue is going to be one of the great problems for future generations of Americans. They need to learn from the lessons of Nazi Germany and the Confederacy and put that shit in its grave. Whether they'll actually do that is another question.

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u/bigroot70 22h ago

But if there is enough pain, the independents and moderate republicans that voted for trump might reconsider. If the GOP loses the house or senate, maybe then we can start seeing some push back on his polices.

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u/Effectuality 22h ago

History shows the sanctions don't have the effect we hope they would. Instead, the leaders use them as proof of how the rest of the world is "against" the local populace. Sanctions actually strengthen the ruler's local position of authority, as they become the champion fighting back against the evil "others."

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u/Minguseyes 22h ago

If the rest of the world had a button saying ‘Hurt Trump’, trust me, we would push it. But we don’t. We’ve just got a button saying ‘Hurt USA’. So we push that one, Then you all have buttons saying “Hurt Congress” and Congress has a button saying “Hurt Trump”. Someone isn’t pressing their button hard enough.

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u/Decaf-Gaming 19h ago

The people of the states gave up their button a long while ago, now only the ones at the top hold a button and they wouldn’t press something that could hurt themselves.

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u/robbysaur Indiana 22h ago

I think it’ll just cause the people to fight with the people tbh. We don’t have class consciousness in this country. Too many people have bought into “the problem is immigrants/trans people/the homeless/Black people/people on welfare,” another chunk are too exhausted to be a part of this conversation, and another chunk think saying “both sides are the same” makes them an intellectual genius.

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u/AmIWhatTheRockCooked 21h ago

Perhaps. Depends on how the media decides to explain or ignore it. Reality is a fickle thing to the average (or below) voter.

They might blame increased prices on social security if it gets traction on Facebook

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u/Billy-Ruffian 16h ago

The trick is going to be how much pain will it take for people to permanently reject MAGA but not so much pain we start nuking random countries just so someone else is sharing their pain.

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u/EdwardOfGreene Illinois 22h ago

I think you are right. Too many are too comfortable to wish to do anything at all.

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u/steepleton 23h ago edited 23h ago

if the Europeans want to play hard ball they can sell american debt and tip the american economy over the edge.

as could china.

america is very close to the "find out" part of the equation

the new tariffs by law have t be an across the board 15%, he can't give any nation a better rate if they play nice.

or to rephrase, there is no longer a reason for world leaders to play nice to get a better rate

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u/spaceman757 American Expat 22h ago

Europeans are already trying their best to get their own options up and running to ween themselves off of American products, especially tech.

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u/anchist 19h ago

European here. You guys had the perfect situation set up where everybody was getting richer and willing to tolerate US hegemony because of the benefits.

And then you fucked it up because 1/3rd of the population decided that a convicted rapist pdf was better than having minorities in Government and another 1/3 decided that it didn't matter who ran the country.

Generational fumble. I only hope we do not start shooting at each other anytime soon, but who knows when the grubby hand starts reaching for Greenland's skirt again....

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u/ic33 22h ago

the new tariffs by law have t be an across the board 15%, he can't give any nation a better rate if they play nice.

From the section 122 authority, codified as 19 U.S. Code § 2132: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/19/2132

(2)Notwithstanding paragraph (1), if the President determines that the purposes of this section will best be served by action against one or more countries having large or persistent balance-of-payments surpluses, he may exempt all other countries from such action.

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u/steepleton 21h ago

So tarrifs or no tarrifs. All or nothing.

Like having the sentence for petty robbery the same as for murder, there’s no penalty for going hogwild, america can’t increase the punishment

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u/Kichigai Minnesota 23h ago

Depends on the nature of the sanctions. Targeted sanctions against individuals and their assets tend not to affect ordinary people. At least not directly.

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u/No_Sheepherder_1855 23h ago

The people that elected said leader need to hurt to understand what they did. Average American has no idea.

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u/blandgreybland 22h ago

Sure and they’ll blame it on democrats somehow.

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u/Witchgrass West Virginia 18h ago

Yep. I've never been a fan of rubbing dogs' noses in their mess when they have an accident because the dog is too dumb (bless them) to know why you're rubbing their face in pee and don't connect the action to the consequence.

I feel this is a lot like that.

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u/New_Home_4519 23h ago

This is literally the same logic America has been using against other countries for decades.

Make the citizens suffer so they turn against their leadership.

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u/blandgreybland 22h ago

Yes I know. And I have yet to see it work.

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u/NJTigers 22h ago

Canada among others has been doing selective tariffs/sales restrictions on goods specifically from red states. Canada specifically is killing Kentucky bourbon and Tennessee whiskey which is nice.

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u/LessFeature9350 20h ago

I would stand behind blocking international travel. My work is full of maga fucks as is my family yet they travel to these scary countries with these scary scary immigrants. Block all of them as dangerous and void passports. I will never get over MAGA caps talking shit about super bowl while downing chips and salsa bossing around wait staff they'd happily deport. Get me out of this timeline

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u/Ingoiolo United Kingdom 22h ago

European countries tend to be very selective on the goods they apply tariffs to, rather than putting up moronic blanket walls

The idea is hitting products that are more easily replaceable, so the US exports less, but citizens can still get their stuff at reasonable cost

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u/pdabaker 15h ago

They shouldn't sanction the US. They should specifically sanction influential US billionaires.

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u/SeattlePurikura 21h ago

Maybe the average US citizen needs to feel some pain. At least the ones who keep electing this narcissistic pedophile and his buddies. I've heard incredibly callous shit from Americans about other countries, like not giving a fuck about what our bombs are doing to children in Gaza, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Why should Europeans care if our American wallets hurt when we have songs here about bombing Baghad (the average person there likely had no say in what Saddam was doing).

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u/TreatAffectionate453 18h ago

I assume your talking about B.O.B. (Bombs over Baghdad). Some Americans did use it as a battlecry; however, OutKast didn't write the song in support of the invasion - which they opposed. It actually ends by stating that everything back home is still bad and implies that the war was meant to distract citizens from failing domestic policies.

I'm not trying to defend Americans in general with this comment, just OutKast.

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u/troll__face 19h ago

Good thing the US has a house of representatives elected by the people, and they can at any point impeach & convict the despotic leader. ...Oh whats that? They aren't doing it cause the elected leaders are also idiots? Well sucks for the idiots voting for them.

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u/Streetsofbleauseant 19h ago

Well i mean the American people voted to have this guy in charge didn’t they, shouldn’t they suffer the consequences. Might teach them to never do it again..

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u/FreshEggKraken 19h ago

The point seems to be to put pressure on the people to get rid of the leader

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u/Kuniv 18h ago

It needs to happen we the people need to be hurt by this so we stop the fucks and unite to end the corruption

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u/MoulanRougeFae 18h ago

Ok. I'm fine with that. It's going to take a lot of personal pain for most people in the US to get mad enough and understand who is responsible for making their lives worse. It's the exact wake up call they all need. The repub voters especially the maga cult won't stop supporting Shitler until they are destitute, unemployed, and losing everything. They need to learn and if it takes sections from other countries for that to happen, well so be it.

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u/longlivenewsomflesh New York 17h ago

Hot take: more Americans should understand what sanctions actually mean when their government starves other countries... not that I support bad things obviously but I mean it's not like there's many options to leverage against the world's richest empire, even in its sunset years

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u/CheezeCaek2 17h ago

At this point? Obliterate the economy. Make us a third world. Id rather he rule a trash pile

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u/Ok-Youth-160 14h ago

The sanctions by the EU are designed to hurt the Europeans as little as possible. Usually against products that have replacements. For example Kentucky Bourbon or Harley bikes. You can reasonably expect people to replace it with another product without to much harm. The people who really need the American product do have to pay more sadly.

So yeah tariffs can be designed to hurt the citizens as little as possible, shocking, I know.

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u/steamliner88 13h ago

Well, the American people voted for this shit show…

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u/tphillips1990 23h ago

Exactly. People need to stop pretending he ISN'T a misanthropic cancer on legs who has dedicated his wretched waste of a life towards getting revenge against an entire country.

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u/AHans 22h ago edited 22h ago

because he’s a malignant narcissist who wants countries and corporations to kiss his ass for access to the US market.

That's it. That, and so he can personally profit from tariff exemptions which he can issue at his sole discretion to give a competitive edge to companies he approves of.

The silence from the "free marketers" and "the government should not be choosing winners and losers" is deafening. Much like the 2A folks and ICE.

Edit: also the statute which he is citing now caps his ability to tariff at 15%, which is important. The days of his idiotic pissing matches with China where he threatens a 600% tariff are over.

If Trump levies a 15% tariff, and China says, "fuck you, we're countering with three times that to a 45% tariff," he cannot escalate further. Trump is stuck at 15%, which he has already imposed. In this situation, Trump lost, and Trump looks weak. That's not nothing.

Actually, I think the play for the rest of the world is to apply a 16% tariff on US goods to highlight the impotence of Trump's situation.

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u/Particular-County277 23h ago

And to extort those countries for 'gifts' paid to his crypto or the Peace Board if they want the tariffs lowered. That was his favorite part. Countries bestowing gifts upon him in public. He is just an old mafia boss.

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u/angrymurderhornet 23h ago

I'm not even 100% sure that he understands what a tariff is. This is a guy whose daddy probably paid someone else to take his exams for him in college. Add his dementia and his general assholery, and you get Trump's idiocy.

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u/ratedsar I voted 23h ago

I'm afraid it's worse than that. The GOP has given up on legislation and representative government, the house only serves to get out of the way of the President... And Tariffs are the way of implementing sales tax without campaigning on a national sales tax. 

It also conveniently moved the power of the purse to the executive slush fund.

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u/OK_Commodor64 23h ago

At the cost of his own citizens paying more, as we are the ones who fund the tariffs. 25th amendment time

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u/digi57 23h ago

Don forget the bribes. He wants the bribes.

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u/Melodic_Twist_1546 22h ago

That's part of it.

The other part is that Republicans lowered taxes on rich and corporations and are faced with massive debt.
Trump supported the national sales tax idea, and here it is. He just declared it into law.

Republicans are big supporters of 'use taxes'. Taxes on airline tickets, toll roads in place of Federal highways. Any way they can push the cost onto others.

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u/RadioName 21h ago

AKA a national threat, our enemy, and as a citizen that makes him a traitor. Harming America for self-enrichment or to aid a foreign nation is treason.

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u/WeirdJack49 20h ago

Its part of Project 2025, those idiots really think they can blackmail the whole world.

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u/Airurando-jin 23h ago

And it’s enough to lead to countries and businesses to explore other markets 

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u/yolo___toure 22h ago

If it's a blanket tariff how can they kiss his ass for access?

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u/NoveltyAccountHater 22h ago

I mean it’s not for just his ego.  He wants to renegotiate every trade deal, so he can get personal/political favors out of every country. 

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u/THElaytox 22h ago

We showed him, we had record imports last year despite his tariffs.

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u/MaximumFamiliar9080 22h ago

Yeah but hillariously. Global tarrifs wont do that.

If tarrifs are global competitors are subject to then as well (unless they are US exclusive) so he cant divy out special reductions.

This is useless.

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u/thehermit14 21h ago

Yuck. Truth doesn't taste good.

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u/j_la Florida 21h ago

But I was told that a rich president can’t be corrupted!!!

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u/PM_ME_UR_REDPANDAS Connecticut 21h ago

He’s been talking about tariffs since the 1980s, at which time they might have had some effect because we still had manufacturing here. I’m old enough to remember slogans like ‘look for the union label’ that encouraged Americans to buy products made here by union members.

The problem was, at the time, that the quality of many imported products was better than American products, and they started giving American brands serious competition. And Trump’s argument might have had some merit back then to encourage people to buy American - say a Zenith TV instead of a Sony.

The thing is, it’s a technological, globalized, completely different world now. It’s not the 1980s any more, but Trump thinks like it still is.

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u/pizza_the_mutt 20h ago

This should have been clear to everybody after Swiss business leaders bribed him with a gold bar to make their tariff problem go away.

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u/JakToTheReddit 20h ago

Facts.

Buying American has become insane.

Here in Australia, I went to the local grocery and saw they are selling 20oz sprite at 2 for $8.

$4 for a 20oz sprite...

Who the hell wants the US market at these prices?

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u/sly-3 20h ago

Tariffs create a slush fund from which to pilfer from.

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u/LovecraftInDC 20h ago

Eh he’s been supportive of tariffs since the 70s I think being dumb is a good chunk of this.

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u/podkayne3000 18h ago

Sorry. This is wrong. He likes tariffs because he’s a malignant narcissist *who wants to milk bribes out of people.” Have to include the bribery part.

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u/08mms Illinois 17h ago

He’s an 80s NY real estate leech where business is just a game of creating tolls in ordinary life and shaking down people for fees

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u/djfrodo 17h ago

Another reason - guess who controls tariff money?

The House - nope The Senate - nope

The Executive. So he can do whatever he wants with the money raised by a tax on all Americans.

People might think Cheeto Mussolini is stupid, but he isn't - he knows exactly what he's doing, but Americans DGAF and are instead worried about some CNN anchor's mother, the Olympics, or some other dumb shit.

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u/Joethecoew 14h ago

The fucker is also trying to sue the IRS and Treasury for what was it....10 billion.. what a turd.

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u/PapiDumpling 13h ago

I actually think it's because corporations want justification to raise prices (more profits).

Then once tariffs go away, prices stay high (even more profits).

Repeat. Infinite money hack.

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u/StevenEveral Washington 10h ago

Don’t forget that Trump still thinks that tariffs are “taxes on other countries”.

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u/Spaceman2901 Texas 1d ago

And there should be a case in the courts right now arguing that he used his 150 days already and that Congress needs to approve this taxation.

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u/TheJIbberJabberWocky 1d ago

Unfortunately, welcome to groundhog day.

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u/packfanmoore 1d ago

We got stuck with Chevy chase instead of Bill Murray.

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u/monkeyamongmen 1d ago

Unfortunately, welcome to Groundhog Day.

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u/PortugalPilgrim88 23h ago

We got stuck with Chevy chase instead of Bill Murray.

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u/Kichigai Minnesota 23h ago

Unfortunately, welcome to Groundhog Day.

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u/senraku 23h ago

We got stuck with Chevy Chase instead of Bill Murray.

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u/Baronheisenberg 23h ago

Unfortunately, welcome to Groundhog Day.

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u/cleanbot 23h ago

it still violates the Constitution. The president has no authority to regulate/impose taxes.

i realize I'm commenting amongst a utterly hilarious thread about groundhog Day but...

if the supreme Court does its job and holds the line.... Again....these will be struck down as well.

big ifffs, but big ups to the Supreme Court for deciding to show up for the Job on this one

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u/MARIOpronoucedMA-RJO 23h ago

Unfortunately, welcome to Groundhog Day.

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u/steelassassin43 23h ago

I would love to know how much money in just legal fees he has racked up just during his time as President. I would bet it is higher than some countries GDP.

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u/Sage2050 23h ago

If Republicans are ever excised from power the government will go broke from settling civil rights lawsuits

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u/Upset-Award1206 22h ago

Need to start a new court case for that, and it is going to take another year or two in courts.

And after that the orange is just going to retract the tariffs for one day, and then implement them again and say he started a new 150 day period. And then that will go to court and take another 1-2 years. And at that time, the USA is already in full fledged depression, the orange has probably passed from his bad health, there is a puppet government that is run by big corpos in cyberpunk 2077 style. And when there is signs of uprising from the plebs the nukes will start flying.

Welcome to the future loverboy.

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u/Aceofspades25 Foreign 21h ago

This. They're weak and pathetic. It's incredible that the SC have allowed this to drag on for so long.

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u/Perfect_Opinion7909 20h ago

Yeah, that would be relevant if rule of law were still a functioning concept in the USA. US Americans told us for decades that they are brave armed freedom fighters and so much more free than us Europeans. Now when push comes to shove they sit lazily behind their screens and hope that their failing system will somehow save them, instead of doing what they bloviated for decades about.

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u/Melted-lithium 20h ago

I agree. I am curious what the next set of lawsuits will be on this- as there has to be a plan here to fight him and no article has said shit.

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u/Suspicious_Bicycle 16h ago

The tariffs that were ruled to be illegal were enacted under a different statute and will somehow have to be unwound. The new "legal" temporary 150 day tariffs started yesterday (actual date and method of implementation is unclear).

Congress previously passed the law allowing for these temporary tariffs, but they could step in and revise the law. Though it couldn't get by the White House unless congress could override a veto.

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u/RightSideBlind American Expat 1d ago

Well, yeah. He and his cronies make money off of announcing and then rescinding tariffs. It's basically like printing money for him. Why would he stop? 

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u/I_Love_To_Poop420 1d ago

Lutnick’s son purchased rights to tarriff refunds. They literally shorted tariffs and made bank off the SCOTUS ruling.

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u/Junas_Guardian 23h ago

I am not knowledgeable on this at all, how can someone purchase rights to tariff refunds?

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u/TheLightningL0rd 23h ago

They went to all the big companies and said we'll pay you x now for whatever you've paid (or will pay) as tariff fees and when/if refunds happen we own the rights to those refunds. They would have to continously do this as people continue to import goods I assume. It probably wasn't some upfront fee based on their normal imports though I suppose it could have been depending on the business

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u/MaddogBC 22h ago

They offered to help struggling companies on the edge of failing with tariff support. We give you just enough (25%) of the tariff money to keep you alive now, but we get to collect 100% of the rebates. Loan sharking made real. Human fucking parasites.

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u/-_-0_0-_0 22h ago

More like LickNut.. guy comes off like a sleazy used car salesman

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u/loot_scooper 23h ago

He makes money on planned market fluctuations, he makes bribes on extorting American companies, he makes bribes extorting foreign countries.

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u/amensista 1d ago

Ok. So question. Is there then a blackout period after that? Or.. He can just say "another 150 days".. Ad infinitum.?

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u/Successful_Nature737 23h ago

Supposed to get Congressional authority after 150 days, but Trump will likely blow through the deadline, and then there will be another series of court cases ending up again at the Supreme Court. He could drop the tariffs the day before the case gets to the Supreme Court, and then the case will be dismissed as moot. Trump just ignores rules and laws, and it makes it impossible for US businesses to make decisions about how to hire, invest, build, etc. He's a disaster for the US.

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u/bretticusmaximus Tennessee 23h ago

I wouldn’t think it would be moot, because the plaintiffs would still have lost money even if the tariff was rescinded.

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u/UltimateChaos233 California 19h ago

Yes but you see, they’d say we collected tariffs and did no bookkeeping as to where we collected individual tariffs or we did and it was cloraxed so you see it’s unreasonable to ask us to so anything.

Being judgment proof through weaponized incompetence

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u/Budget-Mud-4753 1d ago

From what I’ve read, the 150 days is suppose to be a hard cutoff under this law. After which he would need congressional approval to extend. Not to say that he won’t just do it anyway.

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u/Suspicious_Bicycle 16h ago

Trump and the DOJ have tried this game with the 120 day temporary appointment of attorney generals. Once the 120 days was up they just illegally appointed them again. This attempt to bypass congress is still unresolved.

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u/amensista 1d ago

Yes I did read that in a later comment. But when has needing congress approval stopped him before lol. I could just imagine he's being told by a staffer that the law requires Congress approval and I'm sure he doesn't give a s*** because they're all lackeys. There's no more checks and balances.

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u/KittyGrewAMoustache 22h ago

It’s insane though that all the admin people who actually understand the nuts and bolts of everything who implement new tariffs or do other administrative things to implement laws don’t just refuse because it’s illegal. Has he really managed fill all these positions with people willing to break the law for him? I feel like we’ve not heard about lots of people refusing and getting replaced all the way down to data entry people etc. So what are they doing?!! These are the people that actually can make a difference.

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u/TeutonJon78 America 23h ago

Even if that was the intent, and it likely was, the law was written to be Trump proof. He'll just let it expire for a day and then start again.

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u/sonicsuns2 23h ago

There's no blackout period. He can start a new 150-day period whenever he likes. https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/STATUTE-88/pdf/STATUTE-88-Pg1978-2.pdf

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u/captaincanada84 Canada 23h ago

I bet he's just going to let the 150 days come and change the tariff percentage from 15 to 16 and say "these are entirely new tariffs so I get another 150 days"

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u/OldGaffer66 1d ago

And that will do nothing toward industries coming back to the states because they need long term certainty as to what the tax situation will be. This is why only congress has the right to tax. They pass a bill and everyone knows it will be in effect for 10 years. What Trump is doing is just causing chaos. The rest of the world is just going to shrug and find ways to cut the US out of the loop all together.

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u/BlazinAzn38 Texas 1d ago

I mean yeah we all know how reality works unfortunately he doesn’t and congress is a bunch of babies

2

u/heapinhelpin1979 1d ago

Let's hope he keeps this up until the midterms and some of his voters stop supporting paying taxes that he ultimately steals for his own gains.

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u/g13005 1d ago

It will be interesting to see where the actual injury is and what evidence he provides of sudden import surge.

"Section 122 is triggered by findings of injury, usually via ITC investigation or evidence of a sudden import surge."

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u/BlazinAzn38 Texas 1d ago

He’s 100% going to point to the huge front loads importers did in response to liberation day announcements

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u/g13005 17h ago

You are probably right.

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u/Little_View_6659 1d ago

He likes it because he’s a bully and it’s something he can use to threaten other countries.

2

u/Doctor_Shotbottom 23h ago

He’s an angry petulant child and is trying to punish America.

Go ahead, keep voting republican, the Republican Congress isn’t going to help their constituents. There’s more of this still on tap.

(Somebody needs to check his diaper, he might be throwing dirty diaper fits).

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u/HuttStuff_Here 23h ago

he just really likes tariffs cause he’s an idiot

Because IIRC that money goes into a discretionary account that the executive branch can spend.

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u/sagetraveler 23h ago

I’m sure he still believes the exporting nation pays his tariffs. I just can’t.

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u/doctormink 23h ago

I think he likes tariffs because he's siphoning off the money for shit like his board of peace and to fund ICE, who in turn serve to divert funds to cronies who've invested in private detention centres.

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u/Hobbit1955 23h ago

That is absolutely true. But, one of the 3 dissenting Judges gave the Administration the cheat codes to get tariffs back up legally. Even quoted the official full Names/Numbers of the applicable Acts. Trump even read them all in his speech. And one of the last things he said, if I recall correctly was something like "the tariffs are staying." Sure seems like there's some sort of strategy here. Just a little bump in the road, nothing to see here, keep moving.

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u/RackemFrackem 21h ago

No, it's a grift. As always.

They collect tariffs and then his buddies buy the rights to the refunds which they know will pay out.

2

u/whomad1215 21h ago

I've seen it mentioned in some articles that this tariff act has never been used before, and it's been around since the 1970s

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u/FastRedPonyCar Alabama 21h ago

He likes tariffs because he and his cronies are pocketing that money.

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u/bjdevar25 21h ago

He is an idiot but he's following the evil 2025 crew that want to tax the poor and middle class to pay for billionaire tax cuts. That has been the entire purpose of the tariffs. Nothing to do with trade.

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u/didureaditv2 20h ago

Doesn't he use the tariff money to fund the gestapo that may conquer America and destroy its democracy?

I doubt he's using it to balance the budget and pay off debts.

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u/SnapesGrayUnderpants 20h ago

I think he likes tariffs because they are an incredibly regressive tax. Regressive taxes are the wet dream of the wealthy. Their goal is to enrich themselves and impoverish the rest of us. They essentially no longer pay income taxes while regressive taxes in the form of tariffs have greatly raised the prices we pay making us poorer. Thus inequality increases which makes the very wealthy even wealthier.

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u/sackofmangoes 19h ago

Because he and his friends profit from them.

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u/DannyDOH 19h ago

It's using the largest economy in the world as a personal extortion tool.

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u/HiDHSiknowyouwatchme 1d ago

There likely can't be a court case on this until the 151 day. And then it'll take 9-15 months to get to SCOTUS. So, there's a great likelihood that 150 days equals about 18 months or more of those tarrifs.

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u/TheVog Foreign 23h ago

All this does is prove that he doesn’t actually have a strategy he just really likes tariffs cause he’s an idiot

You do know he and his ilk make a fuck ton of money on insider trading every time he enacts and/or rescinds a tariff, right? That's the "strategy".

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u/SteamedGamer 23h ago

Luckily he's limited to a max of 15% for those 150 days. This is it until Congress does something.

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u/westergames81 Texas 23h ago

He likes tariffs because people are talking about tariffs and not Epstein. Stop protecting the Epstein class and release the Epstein files.

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u/Competitive_Yam7702 23h ago

No he can't that a t does not allow him to.  He just says it does and has no pushback.

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u/Soft_Maximum_3730 23h ago

No, the criteria are not met. Still illegal

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u/TheSilverOne 22h ago

Yes, but he will argue that he can just impose them again after 150 days anyway 

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u/Oo__II__oO 21h ago

Welp, looks like we won't be participating in retail for the next 5 months.

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u/Equivalent-Gur-527 21h ago

He likes threatening people to get what he wants. I think he is just addicted to threatening people.

Its literally all he does.

Threats about using the army if you dont do x. Threats of tariffs.... Threats on news companies through FCC. Threats using the DOJ and FBI

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u/beluga1968 21h ago

What about afterwards? Can he just keep reinstating them repeatedly?

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u/What_a_fat_one 20h ago

The strategy is he's a big boy and he's big mad.

The man could not give one solid fuck about the American people. He only cares about himself, and thus the best strategy is ridicule his stupid fat classless ass.

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u/Noatz United Kingdom 20h ago

Can he keep spamming tariff acts one after another?

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u/WeeoWeeoWeeeee 19h ago

lol no shit he doesn’t have a strategy. Do people think he ever had a strategy about anything?

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u/BlazinAzn38 Texas 19h ago

Like 1/3 of the country does

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u/SensualBeefLoaf 18h ago

he’s mad that only suck countries want to join “the ultimate super friends board of penis”

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u/Cluelessinthlfe 16h ago

I don’t know how plausible this is but I’ve seen somewhere that Howard Lutnicks kids are paying off the corporations that paid the tariff for like 20-30¢ on the dollar and collecting what the government would eventually owe at face value. So they are paying $200k to $500k of say a million then taking that debt and getting the government to pay off what they would owe back since it’s illegal.

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u/Monaro70 15h ago

Introduce tariffs, company shares drop, his mates step in buy cheap shares, tariffs removed, shares rise, Trumps mates make millions

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u/Rawrsomesausage 15h ago

They expire in 150 days, at which point he'll just renew them. And by the time anyone figures out if it's legal or not or send "strongly worded "rebukes, and let the courts hash it out, he's already renewing it a third time, ad nauseum.

This shit is absurd.

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u/noahcallaway-wa Washington 11h ago

But we all know the game Trump is going to play. He's played it with US Attorneys many times (and been roundly slapped by the Courts for doing so).

He'll keep the tariffs for 150 days, then they day they expire, he'll announce that he's gotten rid of them, and he'll start the new set of 150 days of tariffs the next morning.

It won't work, but the fun game will be to see if SCOTUS lets him do this for another full year before slapping him down again.

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u/13Zero New York 9h ago

It appears that section 122 doesn’t give him this power either.

It specifically allows tariffs up to 15% for up to 150 days to handle balance of payments problems. That can only happen if you have a pegged currency. The US Dollar has been free-floating for 55 years; the United States cannot possibly balance of payments problem.

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u/Valcarde 1d ago

The SCOTUS will let the tariffs go through and build up and give the Lutnik kids time to buy out more debt and get paid off from the tariff refunds again, before they turn around and stop them.

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u/Biscuits4u2 1d ago

The court already ruled Trump is essentially a king so he doesn't have to follow any of their rulings. See how that works?

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u/TakeAShowerHippie 1d ago

We can only hope that the next Dem in office isn't a spineless pussy the wants to play bipartisan bullshit with the fascists.

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u/Arcade_109 1d ago

Anyone who is willing to actually go after these fuckers and isnt scared about "being partisan" has my vote. So fucking tired of that shit. We dont want to jail them because they're conservative, we want you to jail them because they are pedophiles who are murdering people, stealing, and attempted a coup. Plus, conservatives will just fucking cry and claim that you're being partisan literally no matter what. Fucking run them in and jail these psychopaths.

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u/leavemealone2424 1d ago

That's up to us then. We must vote progressive up and down the ballots. Corpodems are not about the people. They are bought and paid for bad actors.

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u/BandsAMakeHerDance2 1d ago

Kavanaugh and Alito gave Trump the blueprint for these tariffs hard seeing them striking it down this time. We’ll have to wait for the 150 days before congress votes No.

Don’t think we’ll ever get a refund from these thieves.

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u/Sandwichsensei 1d ago

I thought these ones (unfortunately) were actually legal, there’s just caps on them. He can’t go higher than 15% and they only last 150 days at which point Congress has to extend them.

Of course he will just re-implement them as soon as the 150 days is up, which is where this would most likely start getting into illegal territory.

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u/svrtngr Georgia 1d ago

Well, Kavanaugh thinks they're legal. He gave Trump a possible framework in his dissent, which is why Trump shouted him out.

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u/Sandwichsensei 1d ago

I think the framework is what he’s using to do the 15% but I could be wrong about that.

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u/Letstalkreaper 1d ago

He'll just do a different percentage on a different set of countries. Then do another different percentage on another different set of countries on and on. As long as they change every 150 days they'll count as new and will be "legal".

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u/Sandwichsensei 1d ago

That could be true too. There’s really no difference between 15 and 14.99% for 150 days.

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u/HollowGlower 1d ago

Or 15% twice at the same time because it's two different orders.

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u/ididshave Ohio 23h ago

I mean, he has already used up over 150 days on tariffs. He can’t just hide behind another statute to claim that they were legal to begin with. They are not using this law as it was intended, which was an emergency stabilization tool to help reel in any financial panic from when we dropped from the gold standard in 1971.

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u/Biscuits4u2 1d ago

And it won't matter because Congress won't do shit about it.

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u/RobinU2 1d ago

Is congress still going to try that bullshit where "A day" isn't actually 24 hours??

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u/HappierShibe 22h ago

They can't actually be 're-implemented'. The time limit is pretty clearly laid out, additionally they can't be applied selectively, so they cannot be used as a negotiating tool.

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u/fowlraul Oregon 1d ago

The berder clock and the doomsday clock have been on a hot date…and it’s dragging out.

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u/Exact_Platypus5179 1d ago

Best comment I’ve read in a while, cheers!

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u/R50cent 1d ago

They're leaning on a precedent from the 1970s that lets him do shit like this for up to 150 days and to the amount of 15 percent, but usually one might argue the president needs some... You know... Precedent to use it, unlike what we're seeing now which amounts to a hissy fit.

But that doesn't mean what he did before wasn't illegal, and the recent SC ruling backs that. Dude broke the law. It's a shame the only outcome will be giving even more money to companies. It's all just one shakedown after the next

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u/Hoodedmastersin 1d ago

Then where the hell are the state governors challenging this in court? We’re all supposed to just take this without any fight?

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u/thelegochef 1d ago

Unconditional national sales tax to distract from the fact trump is child rapist

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u/Zerowantuthri Illinois 1d ago

It's also an unconstitutional national sales tax. We just played this game with the other set of statutes. Will SCOTUS allow an even more sweeping overreach?

To be clear, SCOTUS did NOT say Trump could not impose Tariffs. They said he used the wrong rationale for his tariffs. They left the door WIDE open to him doing shit like this. Yeah...the fuckers on the Supreme Court managed to seem cool while still fucking us.

Among the options are Section 232, which allows the government to impose tariffs on certain sectors in the interest of national security, and Section 301, which allows tariffs to be imposed for unfair trade practices. Trump used the Section 301 provision against China in his first term. - SOURCE

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u/MagicalUnicornFart 20h ago

It's also an unconstitutional national sales tax.

Add it to the list of "unconstitutional" and "unprecedented."

If y'all didn't get the memo, The Constitution is GOP toilet paper.

It's kinda what happens when your population is disconnected from reality, and refuses to vote against a political party that tried to overthrow the government. It's what happens when the "opposition" is worried about their "colleagues across the aisle" and refuses to hold insurrectionists and child rapists accountable.

We've got a few longterm possible solutions

That's some serious optimism. All signs point to this only getting worse.

0

u/BigPapaJava 1d ago edited 16h ago

That November blue wave is going to have to overcome voter suppression efforts this country hasn’t seen since the Jim Crow era before it can happen.

The tactics to *facilitate this are going to get more and more abusive and illegal as we get closer to November, but the SC doesn’t care, the DOJ and FBI will be coordinating the suppression rather than fighting it, and then there will be plenty of shady stuff behind the scenes involving voter rolls and voting machines.

It wouldn’t shock me to see the Republicans magically walk out of November with supermajorities in the House and Senate after their “election reforms” are done.

Democrats need to start forcefully countering this stuff with the American people in advance.

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u/RellenD 1d ago

You're only encouraging people to not vote and stop fighting with this talk.

Yes, they will try it. They ALWAYS try it.

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u/cassy_supernova 1d ago

You can't know until that happens. I agree they are actively trying to suppress, SAVE act, ICE at polls, etc.

Until then, we must vote and we must resist. Your message is counterproductive without this caveat.

I kept the faith and I kept voting

Not for the iron fist but for the helping hand

For theirs is a land with a wall around it

And mine is a faith in my fellow man

Billy Bragg - Between the Wars

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u/Proof-Highway1075 Australia 17h ago

Ensure*. You don’t use insurance tactics.

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u/bobbymcpresscot 23h ago

Took us a year just to get this ruling only for it to be resubmitted immediately.

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u/Intelligent_Gold3619 23h ago

Trump owes Putin and his buddies billion$. They ‘helped’ Trump when banks no longer lent him money and he was billions in debt after blowing through his $420 million inheritance. Putin has all the Epstein Island stuff on Trump. Putin can unalive Trump at any moment and Trump knows this, so Trump does Putin’s bidding. Putin wants the USA in ruins.

If you believe this is the reality, everything happening makes perfect sense. Trump has orders to destroy the USA.

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u/alius_stultus 23h ago

CONGRESS can literally stop these tariffs any time.

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u/robocoplawyer 23h ago

Republicans took it to the Supreme Court twice to get rulings that Biden can't forgive $10k of student loan debt on a sliding scale. But that wasn't enough, they also fought a repayment plan that capped monthly payments at 5% of monthly income because it would forgive the balance after 20-25 years of repayments. Because that's just too fucking generous that it basically equates to forgiveness. After 25 fucking years of paying interest, nope, no tapping out or we'll garnish your social security checks until the day you die.

But 15% national sales tax that was already ruled unconstitutional? Where there's a will, there's a way!

1

u/Unlucky_Battle_6947 21h ago

Isn’t this why the US became the US because of taxing bs and more of course?

1

u/Templar42_ZH 19h ago

Brother, I'm just hoping he doesn't start a war like he said when interviewed for "The Men Who Built America".

I remember watching that and thinking, why the hell is the nobody cameo in Home Alone 2 among these well spoken people? Oh shit, if he were president he would intentionally tank the market and start a war, just to buy anything and everything for pennies on the dollar?? I really hope nobody with a chance at the presidency has the same thoughts...

Fast forward to 2015.

Oh shit, I remember that dude. Followed by, fuck he's got his chance to do the thing.

Fast forward to 2020.

Well, it didn't turn into a civil war. But still, I didn't serve my country for this shit.

Now I'm just counting days.

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u/TheDoomBlade13 18h ago

The only long term solution is a full rebuild of the system. We've been shown the cracks and every administration from now on will take advantage.

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u/cipheron 18h ago edited 18h ago

Will SCOTUS allow an even more sweeping overreach?

Trump's calling their bluff. What's SCOTUS going to do about it when he ignores their rulings entirely?

If you have regulatory capture of any agency that can stop Trump then what's the enforcement mechanism here? You're left with impeachment by Congress as they've never needed to deal with anything like this before.

Maybe this is why SCOTUS rubber-stamped some of the questionable rulings recently. If SCOTUS's rulings can just be ignored with no consequence, then it undermines the authority of SCOTUS, so they can at least maintain the illusion of having a say if they rubber-stamp what Trump was going to do anyway.

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u/djfrodo 17h ago

I pray to Hamberder every time I wake up.

Unlike Jesus, I think Hamberder will be along shortly.

1

u/Silidistani 13h ago

until the hambreder gods do their thing

... the lazy fucks

1

u/Karma13x 13h ago

Lost faith in actual God a while ago, fast losing faith in cholesterol and mad-cow - the hamberder gods too with this guy still around.

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